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Thread: Bears Mailbag: How about Mankins?

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    Bears Mailbag: How about Mankins?

    First off, thanks for giving some semblance of normalcy in the life of this locked out NFL beat reporter with your thorough and insightful questions about the Bears.

    We kick off our first mailbag in what seems like forever with no signs of football in the immediate future. But hey, at least we can discuss the sport we love, right?


    [+] Enlarge Tom Croke/Icon SMILogan Mankins earned All-Pro honors despite playing in just nine games last season.


    As I perused several of your questions, I noticed two prevailing themes: New England Patriots guard Logan Mankins, and whether the Bears will be in the market -- when and if free agency ever begins -- for a veteran receiver.

    Let’s take care of Mankins first.

    One of the 10 named plantiffs in the former union’s lawsuit against the NFL, Mankins was assigned the franchise tag in February, which means the all-Pro guard likely won’t be signing with another team. In tagging Mankins, the Patriots protect one of their best assets by securing his rights for the short term while essentially buying more time to discuss a long-term deal with him. Had the Patriots not tagged him, Mankins could test free agency with no restrictions.

    But now that he’s tagged, Mankins can sign an offer sheet with a new team, but if the Patriots decline to match, they’ll receive two first-round picks from the new club as compensation for losing him. Let’s remember that Bears general manager Jerry Angelo has said he’s no longer interested in mortgaging the team’s future by giving up draft picks.

    Where this gets hairy is the uncertainty associated with the current labor situation. As it stands, the league’s owners and the former union disagree about the validity of the franchise tag. Players believe franchise tags are worthless because there’s no collective bargaining agreement in place for 2011. The former union’s stance is that players restricted by franchise tags have a strong case for unrestricted free agency because they can’t be restricted by such tags at the same time they’re locked out by the owners.

    It’s believed that Mankins doesn’t plan to sign his tender once the league year begins. But would it even be valid? Until the 8th Circuit Court of Appeals in St. Louis makes a decision about whether to grant a permanent stay of the lockout injunction, it’s up in the air as to when free agency will actually kick off, and what the rules will be.

    So based on the limited information available, the prospects for seeing Mankins in a Bears uniform in 2011 appear to be a long shot.

    Now, let’s get to your questions.

    Q: If there is no season next year, how would the draft order for the 2012 draft look: completely random or would we have the 29th pick? -- Andrew (Champaign)
    A: Good question, Andrew. But I’ve got bad news. Since 1936, teams have selected players in reverse order of their records from the previous season. But under the scenario you described in your question that would mean there’s no collective bargaining agreement in place, and thus no 2012 NFL draft. What does that mean? Well, if there’s no draft, that means there’s probably no salary cap, and no floor, either, making it possible for teams to pay as much or as little as they wanted to acquire talent
    General managers and personnel men around the league have described such a scenario as total chaos. Some have said that the without a draft, the period in which teams would be allowed to sign college players would be very much like unrestricted free agency with players receiving blockbuster deals once the signing period began.

    Some believe it would turn the NFL in to a league of haves and have nots (for the teams and the players) because teams would simply have to outbid one another to get the top players. Others have said such a scenario would greatly benefit the teams with top-notch scouts and personnel departments.

    The draft exists because the union and owners agreed to its terms in the CBA, but that agreement came to an end with the 2011 draft.


    Chuck Cook/US PresswireThe Saints' Reggie Bush doesn't appear to be a good fit for the Bears.


    Q: Maybe it’s time to get over the fact that Matt Forte isn't the elite back we all thought he could be. With the Saints looking to drop Reggie Bush, should the Bears look to acquire him? He'd be perfect for Martz system. Marshall Faulk all over again! -- Martin (Chicago)
    A: I won’t call Forte “elite,” Martin. But the numbers don’t lie when it comes to placing a value on Forte’s contributions, and I’d say he’s close to being on the cusp of that status. Forte is the first player in franchise history to gain at least 1,400 yards from scrimmage in each of his first three NFL seasons. Since entering the NFL in 2008, Forte ranks fifth in the NFL in yards from scrimmage (4,731) behind Tennessee’s Chris Johnson, Minnesota’s Adrian Peterson, Jacksonville’s Maurice Jones-Drew and St. Louis’ Steven Jackson. And no, you didn’t see Bush’s name among those players.

    It’s important to remember the Bears already invested $7 million guaranteed in backup running back Chester Taylor, and before the lockout they were in talks with Forte about an extension. I understand your excitement about potentially adding Bush. He’s an exciting player. But Bush has proven to be inconsistent and injury prone over his first five seasons. Did I mention that statistically, Forte has done more over his three-year career than Bush (19 fumbles) has done in five years? As I said, the numbers don’t lie.

    Q: Where does Herman Johnson fit into the offensive line plans? The Bears have said they need to get big inside because of the division's nose tackles (Raji, Suh, Williams, etc.). He has massive size. Does he get a chance at guard? -- Mike (Valparaiso, Ind.)
    A: Mike, Johnson is one of the players who will be hurt most by this lockout because he’s basically been robbed of the opportunity to impress the coaching staff by the strides he could make in an offseason program. At 6 foot 7, 360 pounds, Johnson definitely fits the mold of the humungous players coveted by offensive line coach Mike Tice. But whether he gets an opportunity -- a legitimate one, anyway -- remains uncertain because under the current circumstances with the labor strife, the team simply might not have enough time to cultivate him and/or thoroughly evaluate him. Johnson’s best shot at competing for a chance to contribute in 2011 is to report to the team (whenever they’re allowed to) in tip-top shape. The Bears have told me they’re not concerned about players reporting out of shape. But with a guy as big as Johnson, you’ve got to be at least a little worried.

    Q: Why doesn't the Bears front office just fork up some more cash for a couple of years and snag a veteran WR with talent and quickness? We seem to have soldiers who have played in the trenches plenty of times and vets playing at virtually every position other than WR. With Chad Ochocinco, Steve Smith and Sidney Rice expressing a desire to search other options, I say why not? -- Chris (West Des Moines, Iowa)
    A: Chris, I don’t think cash is the issue as much as finding the right fit for Martz’s offense. With this lockout going on, I’ve had a chance to spend a little time studying Martz’s playbook from his time with the Rams. And from what I’ve seen of it, I can understand Chicago’s reluctance to just go out and sign the tall receiver that everyone is clamoring for. Ochocinco and Smith possess the skill set (great route running, spatial awareness, and change-of-direction skills) necessary to flourish in Martz’s offense. I’m not sure the Bears would want to deal with Ochocinco’s personality (Lovie Smith doesn’t do drama, trust me) and Rice simply doesn’t fit. Smith, meanwhile, might be an option. He’s on the downside of his career, and could mentor the younger receivers, and I’d be willing to bet that if they haven’t already, they’ll get a report on Smith from Julius Peppers, his former teammate at Carolina.

    Q: Last offseason we heard from Martz that the Bear's wide receiver group was one of the strengths of this team, and then their limitations appeared to come out on the field. Are the Bears planning to go after a free agent or two at the position, or are they still hoping for real development from their young group? -- Ben (Chicago)
    A: Ben, as I told Chris, it’s more about finding the right fit than anything else right now. Do the Bears want to find a veteran free agent to bolster the receiving corps? Sure they do. But they’ve got to find guys who fit the system. Say your team had trouble getting to the quarterback last season. Well, that problem doesn’t automatically get solved by adding a defensive end. You have to add the right defensive end. It’s the same thing with this team’s receivers. The Bears are optimistic that guys like Johnny Knox, Earl Bennett and Devin Hester will make huge strides between Year 1 and Year 2 of Martz’s system. But that jump is in jeopardy with this lockout. I think the Bears have a couple of potential free agent targets in mind, but I don’t see them going after one of the big-name guy like Ochocinco.


    [+] Enlarge Jonathan Daniel/Getty ImagesThe Bears are hoping Chris Williams can develop somewhere along the offensive line.


    Q: Why do so many articles bash Chris Williams’ ability to play at least a guard position? My big knock on Williams is that he is repeatedly injured. But, from what I have seen, he can protect the blind side against the inside rush men. Am I wrong and he played poorly, or is it just frustration that is not lived up to a 14th overall pick? -- Randall (Kalamazoo, Mich.)
    A: Randall, I don’t want to say you’re wrong. I’d say it’s a little bit of both -- inconsistent play and disappointment he hasn’t lived up to first-round billing -- from the team’s standpoint. Even Lovie Smith mentioned that Williams didn’t quite live up to expectations at guard or tackle last season. Smith said the team’s offseason project is to put Williams at one position and leave him there for the duration to give him a chance to flourish. So don’t expect Tice to play musical chairs with Williams once the team gets back to business. This is sort of a put up or shut up year for Williams, based on everything the coaches have told me.

    Q: Hey fellas, Chris Conte: was he a reach in the third round or an under the radar, potential starter? They're obviously high on him, given coach John Hoke's ties to Cal, but I think the pick could have been used to address depth at cornerback, center, or receiver. Can we agree that Conte probably would have been available in the fifth or sixth round, thus making him a wasted pick? Please tell me I'm wrong. -- Michael (Philadelphia, Pa.)
    A: Like you, my first inclination was Conte was a major reach. But then I heard Jerry Angelo talk about the high marks given to Conte by Clancy Pendergast, the defensive coordinator at Cal, and I gave it a little more thought. Sure it’s one thing to give a good recommendation to your guy, but Pendergast is a guy who spent 14 years coaching in the NFL and has a reputation to maintain/protect. I spent a little time covering the Cowboys while Pendergast was coaching defensive backs there, and I can tell you he knew his stuff when it came to developing younger players in the secondary. Angelo mentioned that Pendergast said that it was a “no brainer” for the Bears to draft Conte.

    I agree with you that Conte probably would have been available later in the draft, but I will say that I’ve heard different things about him from the scouts that I know. The biggest knock I’ve heard on Conte is the fact he’s got only one year of experience at the position. But some of the scouts I spoke to saw that as a plus because they believe he’s got upside. The scouts also liked his size (6-2, 197 pounds). Let’s remember that the Bears didn’t draft Conte to start in 2011. He’s kind of more of a jar-in-the-cupboard type of player the Bears hope to develop for the future.

    Q: Hey guys, I'm curious about the Bears’ plans for J'Marcus Webb. It seems like the starting tackles for 2011 are Webb and Gabe Carimi, and now the Bears are just trying to figure out who plays on the left and right side. Is J'Marcus really good enough to play on the blind side? Is Carimi? Add Chris Williams and Frank Omiyale, and it seems like the Bears have four right tackles and zero left tackles. Who will play on the left side in 2011? -- Matt (San Carlos, Calif.)
    A: Matt that was the first question we asked once the Bears drafted Carimi, and Lovie and Tice have said that the plan is to try the rookie on the left side first. Carimi held his own last season against three players (Adrian Clayborn, Ryan Kerrigan, Cam Heyward) drafted in the first round, not to mention his day-to-day practice battles with former Wisconsin teammate J.J. Watt, also a first-rounder.

    Based on Carimi’s college production as a four-year starter at left tackle, his reputation for being a hard worker, and surprisingly polished technique, the Bears expect him to be able to step in and protect Jay Cutler’s blind side as a rookie. The team also expects offensive line guru Tice to quickly help Carimi refine some of the technical deficiencies in his game to have him ready by opening day.

    Q: Great work guys. What are the chances that we see a contribution from Joshua Moore this year? Unless we are planning to sign some cornerback help in free agency, we didn't do anything in the draft to fortify the position. Are they hoping for Zack Bowman to learn from spending a lot of the year on the bench? With the Packers and Lions receiving corps, I am worried about the position. -- Vik (Tampa, Fla.)
    A: Thanks for the compliment. I would say there’s a decent chance you could see some contributions from Moore in 2011. Lovie Smith is extremely high on him, and told me he almost considers Moore a 2011 draft pick who got somewhat of a redshirt season in the NFL in 2010. As for Bowman, it’s the same thing. Smith told me that he thinks Bowman can “be a star” in the NFL, but will have to regain his confidence after a shaky 2010 campaign. I can pretty much guarantee you that Bowman will be given ample opportunity to regain the starting job he lost to Tim Jennings. But Moore will also be in the mix as a potential starter.

    Q: Does Andy Fantuz from the CFL have a chance at making the team? He has the height that the WR corps sorely lacks. -- Ben (Great Falls, Mont.)
    A: Ben, I’m just giving you my honest opinion here (I’ve been wrong before), but I don’t think so. Fantuz received a $10,000 signing bonus when he signed in February, but in my opinion, if he were as much of a sought after a commodity as advertised, the Bears probably would have had to outbid other teams to sign him. I mentioned earlier that the statistics don’t lie. Well, in five CFL seasons, Fantuz had only one 1,000-yard season, and never scored more than seven touchdowns. Because of his size (6-4, 221 pounds), I disregarded those numbers at first.

    Then, I got on YouTube to watch some footage of Fantuz. It could be just me, but Fantuz looked really slow against CFL defenders. I acknowledge that speed isn’t everything. But watch his footage and judge for yourself. That lack of speed just seems a bit unsettling t

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    A few things: this guy is giving our receiving corp. WAY too much credit, i like that carimi will be started as the LT (sorta) and we outbid several teams for fntuz, but i doubt he makes the team as well...


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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry Burris View Post
    A few things: this guy is giving our receiving corp. WAY too much credit, i like that carimi will be started as the LT (sorta) and we outbid several teams for fntuz, but i doubt he makes the team as well...
    I think that Johnny Knox has the makings of becoming another Steve Smith in the NFL. He has the speed and the quickness to become a long ball threat, and if we upgrade our OL well enough to incorporate Martz's deep pass offense (even with the increase of the running game last season, the run was utilized to set up the deep pass), I could see him being like Steve Smith, Isaac Bruce, or Torrey Holt. Earl Bennett has the ability to have 500-700 receiving yards per year. The real drop off is when you get to Devin Hester and Rashied Davis. Those two are nowhere near on the same level as Knox and Bennett.

    I don't agree with this guy's assertion that Jerry Angelo shouldn't go after a big wide receiver. I think that's the key thing everybody forgets about. When Jay Cutler was at his best in Denver, he had Brandon Marshall to throw to. Marshall is at least 6'3" without my having to look, and he could go up and snag those big jump passes from Cutler that only he could reach over a DB. For Martz to ignore this fact is truly stupid. Cutler has done nicely with the tools he has been given, but he needs more groceries in the refrigerator. The more, the merrier. Santonio Holmes would even be a nice addition since he's only about 6'0" and is a clutch, big time performer with the Jets.

    It would be nice to think that JA would go after Logan Mankins in the way(s) that were mentioned in the article, but I just don't see that happening. If we were to go back to the 2009 rules or to a new set of rules for 2011, most likely he will be franchise tagged by the Pats, and for him to decline the Pats offer to him (in a form I believe that he would be tendered but don't quote me on that) and accept something from would be both a blessing and a curse since we would have to give up the two draft picks, as the article said. Jerry Angelo made an exception for mortgaging the Bears' draft picks for the 2009 and 2010 seasons when he Jay Cutler because it was a once in a lifetime opportunity for us to get a quality quarterback who could lead us to a Super Bowl. So far, Cutler has delivered, and Angelo hasn't proven to be a complete and utter buffoon just yet. In a twisted sort of way, I hope that the NFL sticks with the 2010 rules for now if it meant that we could sign an untagged Mankins in free agency.

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    I wouldn't count on mankin. Likely will cost too much to get him, and cost an arm and a leg to sign him. Though to save Cutler's arms, legs, and brain it might be worth it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry Burris View Post
    A few things: this guy is giving our receiving corp. WAY too much credit, i like that carimi will be started as the LT (sorta) and we outbid several teams for fntuz, but i doubt he makes the team as well...
    Those bids must not have been very big if all we gave him was $10 grand to sign. Don't think that was much of a risk to take. The laundry bill for training camp is probably more than that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by soulman View Post
    Those bids must not have been very big if all we gave him was $10 grand to sign. Don't think that was much of a risk to take. The laundry bill for training camp is probably more than that.
    Fantuz could be the next Malcom Floyd, though. I said this in another thread: Floyd was undrafted and was cut at least twice before he caught on with the Chargers. This guy, according to Globe, has excellent hands and knows how to shed defenders, but his one weakness (and it's a big one) is that he rounds off routes. I don't know if that can be fixed or not, but I would like to give him a fair shake to see if he can at least be as good as Davis or, God forbid I say this, Hester. And, you never know, he might be able to play special teams sometime down the line.

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    We don't need another non-route running WR. Knox causes Cutler enough INTs with his sloppy routes as it is....


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    Quote Originally Posted by Dagan81 View Post
    Fantuz could be the next Malcom Floyd, though. I said this in another thread: Floyd was undrafted and was cut at least twice before he caught on with the Chargers. This guy, according to Globe, has excellent hands and knows how to shed defenders, but his one weakness (and it's a big one) is that he rounds off routes. I don't know if that can be fixed or not, but I would like to give him a fair shake to see if he can at least be as good as Davis or, God forbid I say this, Hester. And, you never know, he might be able to play special teams sometime down the line.
    Seems to me this guy would have been better if he were here in '09 under Turner. Not sure if he can make the cut with Martz. Plus, we have no idea if this guy could get off the jam because in the CFL the WRs get a running start. Many of the flaws in his game will make it difficult for him to succede in a timing based offense.
    As far as correcting those flaws? We have Darryl Drake and Andy has had what, 5 years to work on this? He's worked out for several other teams and they all took a pass on him, as recently as last year.
    You never know what could happen, but I am keeping my expectations real low with this guy.

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    If mankins were available next year, i'd still sign a guard this year and snatch him up next year. Then there'd be at least 3 positions of the line set for a while...


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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry Burris View Post
    If mankins were available next year, i'd still sign a guard this year and snatch him up next year. Then there'd be at least 3 positions of the line set for a while...
    It's tragic that Mankins has been franchise tagged by the Pats, but hopefully the CBA will kick in sooner than later and we'll have our pick of the litter from Davin Joseph to Harvey Dahl, and others. Next year, I think Mankins, Kalil, Nicks, et. al., will be available as unrestricted free agents, so we could well be in a win-win situation for free agents in the 2012 offseason.

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