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Thread: Are Veteran Players Outpricing Themselves; Kruetz for Example?

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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    Are Veteran Players Outpricing Themselves; Kruetz for Example?

    A buyer's market

    Are veterans pricing themselves out of the league? Jack Bechta
    Print ThisSend ThisAugust 10, 2011, 04:00 PM EST
    4 Comments



    There are some casualties from the new CBA this year, a big slice of the 500 plus unrestricted free agents that hit the market place. Granted some of the younger players, ages 26 to 29, are reaping the rewards with some big contracts, but not at the rate they did under the previous CBA. As of today there have been 279 free agent signings but about 150 free agents still looking for jobs. About half those players were making over $2 million a year last season. Now many are shell-shocked by not having a contract and are wondering what the hell happened.

    One GM put it to me this way; “we are buying youth but renting vets.” Any player over 30 is identified as an emergency player for us who will have to stay on call and do a work out for us.” Another summed it up as saying, “it’s a buyer’s market and there is a huge supply of serviceable talent but I am not going to pay a premium for it”.
    ICONAl Harris refused to be a victim of the current free agent market and signed with the Rams.

    Many NFL personnel men are telling me that they are concerned that older players could have “gotten old” in the off-season. There is too much injury risk without an off-season and they don’t feel good in bringing in players they don’t have a history with. The bottom line is that most players in their thirties that are still on the street are going to have to play near or at the minimum. However, many players and their agents may be pricing their clients out of the market.

    Back in March, client CB Al Harris asked me what I thought his market value would be when he becomes a free agent. I told him he should price himself as a third or even a fourth corner to garner a market, and at the vet minimum, which for him is $910,000. I told him he probably couldn’t command much more than that.” Al was quiet for a moment and said; “are you sure”? I replied firmly with an “absolutely”. He then said; “okay, lets go get it”.

    Pricing Al at the minimum and protecting teams against injury risk for players his age, I offered up maximum protection for the team, which helped to draw interest, and it even allowed me to get Al a nominal signing bonus from the Rams. With a higher injury benefit in place under the new CBA, teams are being extra cautious with older players because of the higher benefit they will be on the hook for.

    Unfortunately, some players' pride and ego won’t let them listen to the reality of the marketplace and thus they price themselves out of a job. Agents who don’t recognize the shift in the marketplace and are not willing to deliver the bad news to their client, may be ending the player’s career prematurely.

    Two years ago, a client told me he wanted to be the highest paid player at his position in the league. I told him I would try but I didn’t think it was realistic. I told him I think I could make him top ten with his current team or in free agency. In his previous contract, I had gotten him in the top 6 at his position with a year still remaining on his contract. I then made the best presentation I have ever made to his current team trying to reach the client’s goal but it was too rich for their blood. The client then hired a new higher profile agent who promised him he could achieve his goal. The client decided to go to free agency with a new agent but unfortunately got injured towards the end of his last year. The new agent shopped the player at high end numbers anyway but eventually only achieved a near minimum contract. The player’s inflated value of himself cost him millions of guaranteed money that he could have gotten from his current team.

    The conundrum for agents willing to be realistic with their clients about their market value is that player may shoot the messenger (their agent) and hire the next guy who is telling them what they want to hear.

    Those players who are still on the street may want to reassess their value and their agents may want to reset their demands. There is still some money left in the till that teams would be required to spend on players. However, that money will most likely go to extending current younger players on the roster versus signing new ones. For many it will be the end of the road.

    When you see players announcing their retirement, many times it’s because their pride is getting in the way of some good money still to be made. And unfortunately, they have no idea how hard it is to make a million dollars in the real world.

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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    This may be more appropriately posted in the General Forum but because I love Jack Bechta's slant on things and the fact that what he reports is directly related to what we just went through with Olin Kruetz, and later this year may have to deal with on extensions for other vets like Chris Harris, I thought it would be of interest and Bear related in an offhand way.

    Jack seems to confirm the position that many of you were taking regarding not only the Kruetz situation but others as well as it relates to our signing vet Olineman for a reasonable amount of money. I also thought you guys would get a kick out of his last statement. I've paraphrased it.

    "Some of these guys have no idea how difficult it is to make a million dollars in the real world".

    Maybe they need to talk with guys like Rashaan Salaam and Ray Guy to remind them. Super Bowl Rings and Heismann Rings don't bring that much in the open market these days.
    Last edited by soulman; 08-12-2011 at 03:38 PM.
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    Senior Member short faced bear's Avatar
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    One GM put it to me this way; “we are buying youth but renting vets.” Any player over 30 is identified as an emergency player for us who will have to stay on call and do a work out for us.” Another summed it up as saying, “it’s a buyer’s market and there is a huge supply of serviceable talent but I am not going to pay a premium for it”.

    I wonder if JA was counting on this glut to help him bag cheaper players but mis-timed or planned it.
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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by short faced bear View Post
    One GM put it to me this way; “we are buying youth but renting vets.” Any player over 30 is identified as an emergency player for us who will have to stay on call and do a work out for us.” Another summed it up as saying, “it’s a buyer’s market and there is a huge supply of serviceable talent but I am not going to pay a premium for it”.

    I wonder if JA was counting on this glut to help him bag cheaper players but mis-timed or planned it.
    I don't think there's any question about it. He's doing it, the Colts are doing it and who knows who else may still be looking for guys on the cheap. If you're just trying to fill out some roster depth at key spots getting former starters at backups prices (like Al Harris) isn't a bad way to go. You only have to look at how much less we spent this year for 7 or eight guys compared to what we spent last year just on Peppers alone, not that Peppers wasn't money well spent.

    I think what you're beginning to see is a shift in the salary profile of players. It used to be that a player's pay would tend to increase throughout his career with his best earning years coming towards the end. Now it looks like the pay scale will look more like a bell curve where the big money will come in the middle year of a players career and decline after age 30. All the more reason these guys want FA after 4 years so that they can score that big contract when they're going into their prime in their mid 20's. We saw a lot of FA's this year who were anywhere from 3 to 6 years older than that which is also why there are more bargains still out there.
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    Senior Member Blue Horse-shoe's Avatar
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    Some players are going to find out real quick what the real world is like and the vet minimum is going to look pretty damn good.
    What should you call any : Fumble , Hold , Interception , Three and out , or Sack ?

    A " F.H.I.T.S " ? or a J'Marcus ?

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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Horse-shoe View Post
    Some players are going to find out real quick what the real world is like and the vet minimum is going to look pretty damn good.
    Here are the salary minimums for 2010. They're slightly higher for 2011.

    Is there a minimum salary a player can earn in the NFL?

    Answer:

    In 2008, $295k

    In 2009, $310k

    In 2010, $325k

    In 2011, $340k

    In 2012, $355k

    The NFL Players Union and the NFL owner's usually construct a new "minimum salary" deal every 4 or 5 years.


    *** These numbers are accurate but are for players with zero years experience, i.e. rookies. The amounts go up with player experience, topping out at $845,000 in 2009 for players with 10 or more years experience. Also, unlike some or much of the money in the very high dollar contracts of the top players, none of this money is guaranteed. You have to play to get it.

    Here's the whole chart through 2010:

    Credited Seasons 2008 2009 2010

    0 $295,000 $310,000 $325,000

    1 $370,000 $385,000 $400,000

    2 $445,000 $460,000 $475,000

    3 $520,000 $535,000 $550,000

    4-6 $605,000 $620,000 $635,000

    7-9 $730,000 $745,000 $760,000

    10+ $830,000 $845,000 $860,000
    Last edited by soulman; 08-12-2011 at 10:05 PM.
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    Senior Member Blue Horse-shoe's Avatar
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    $340k to most of us would be unbelievable. They should realize how lucky they are, take their money and shut up .... or retire I don't care.
    What should you call any : Fumble , Hold , Interception , Three and out , or Sack ?

    A " F.H.I.T.S " ? or a J'Marcus ?

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    I look at Tatupu and Hayden now...

    they exactly fit that. Sign for cheap or retire

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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Horse-shoe View Post
    $340k to most of us would be unbelievable. They should realize how lucky they are, take their money and shut up .... or retire I don't care.
    Yeah I've got good hands so I could hold for PK's for that $340k, LOL. Look at what 7-10 year vets get. For 2011 it's probably $775k - $875k for the year and most can probably pick up a signing bonus to go along with that if there's some bidding for them taking place.
    I'm getting to that age where a lifetime warranty just doesn't mean as much to me anymore as an afternoon nap.



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    Quote Originally Posted by short faced bear View Post
    One GM put it to me this way; “we are buying youth but renting vets.” Any player over 30 is identified as an emergency player for us who will have to stay on call and do a work out for us.” Another summed it up as saying, “it’s a buyer’s market and there is a huge supply of serviceable talent but I am not going to pay a premium for it”.

    I wonder if JA was counting on this glut to help him bag cheaper players but mis-timed or planned it.
    Once teams rosters get cut JA will be licking his chops for OL replacements.

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