Thread: Tice on Webb Following Giant Game and Other News...............

The twist you guys put on statements, and how you hang on every word amazes me.

I have one word. Development. You guys expect a late round pick to be perfect, and if they aren't you also have no expectations of improvement. Is it perfectly possible that they made clabo an offer for immediate improvement while Webb develops and then have a good left tackle to trade for picks? Yes. Is it possible that Tices comments aren't bullshit? Yes.

I would be willing to bet that that Webb will improve greatly through the season. Cwill will be a helluva lot better LG than he was last year. Garza will probably decline. Louis? Will probably improve and we will see what Carimi is made of.

Originally Posted by blinddeafmute

The twist you guys put on statements, and how you hang on every word amazes me.

I have one word. Development. You guys expect a late round pick to be perfect, and if they aren't you also have no expectations of improvement. Is it perfectly possible that they made clabo an offer for immediate improvement while Webb develops and then have a good left tackle to trade for picks? Yes. Is it possible that Tices comments aren't bullshit? Yes.

I would be willing to bet that that Webb will improve greatly through the season. Cwill will be a helluva lot better LG than he was last year. Garza will probably decline. Louis? Will probably improve and we will see what Carimi is made of.

I can answer this BDM. IMO opinion the answer to the first question is NO,. Why?

Because Clabo is a RT and Tice had already made his mind up to start Carimi there. He said as much all spring long. Clabo was still available when they made their bids for both Bushrod and Colon and there wasn't even a hint of news that they were even sniffing him. If Tice already had his RT in Carimi we didn't need another from FA.

The only reason that we took a shot at Colon is that he could move to RG in the event that Olin didn't return and Garza was moved to OC and of course that's what happened but instead of Colon we have to take our shot with Louis.

The last thing is I have is to ask you a question. Why would they go to the trouble of developing Webb into a solid LT and then trade him for picks? Not many teams trade good LTs when they have them unless the guy has injury issues or baggage.

And to the second question I'd say sure it's possible but look at the facts and what they did not what they're now saying.

If they had been set on Webb at LT why wouldn't they have just gone after a stop gap player like Matt Light and signed him to a two year deal and then continued to develop Webb without pressure? No, they didn't do that and instead they took a shot at a 26 year old guy who was much farther along in his development than Webb. So considering what they did, not what they're saying, who do you think would have been the LT of the future, Webb or Bushrod.

I think Mike Tice believes that he can turn Webb into a decent LT but I'm willing to bet that even he would admit if you pressed him that Webb is nowhere near that now. Webb is still a major project at this point in time and we're taking a huge risk playing him at LT this year.

I'm not saying that both Webb and Louis won't develop into very good players but I've also said that there is a reason that they lasted until the 7th round and that's because they're both project type players. That's fine because we need that type in the pipeline but the line needed to get much better now and there's some doubt in my mind whether or not those two can make it so.

Originally Posted by soulman

I can answer this BDM. IMO opinion the answer to the first question is NO,. Why?

Because Clabo is a RT and Tice had already made his mind up to start Carimi there. He said as much all spring long. Clabo was still available when they made their bids for both Bushrod and Colon and there wasn't even a hint of news that they were even sniffing him. If Tice already had his RT in Carimi we didn't need another from FA.

The only reason that we took a shot at Colon is that he could move to RG in the event that Olin didn't return and Garza was moved to OC and of course that's what happened but instead of Colon we have to take our shot with Louis.

The last thing is I have is to ask you a question. Why would they go to the trouble of developing Webb into a solid LT and then trade him for picks? Not many teams trade good LTs when they have them unless the guy has injury issues or baggage.

And to the second question I'd say sure it's possible but look at the facts and what they did not what they're now saying.

If they had been set on Webb at LT why wouldn't they have just gone after a stop gap player like Matt Light and signed him to a two year deal and then continued to develop Webb without pressure? No, they didn't do that and instead they took a shot at a 26 year old guy who was much farther along in his development than Webb. So considering what they did, not what they're saying, who do you think would have been the LT of the future, Webb or Bushrod.

I think Mike Tice believes that he can turn Webb into a decent LT but I'm willing to bet that even he would admit if you pressed him that Webb is nowhere near that now. Webb is still a major project at this point in time and we're taking a huge risk playing him at LT this year.

I'm not saying that both Webb and Louis won't develop into very good players but I've also said that there is a reason that they lasted until the 7th round and that's because they're both project type players. That's fine because we need that type in the pipeline but the line needed to get much better now and there's some doubt in my mind whether or not those two can make it so.

I accidentally said Clabo, when I meant bushrod.

What I was saying, and still makes perfect sense, is that Webb (and you even state it) is a project player. He has skill sets, but needs improvement to be a quality player. Obviously Tice thinks he can get there. Why else would he move him to LT instead of Carimi? The reason for making an offer to bushrod was for an immediate improvement. That doesn't mean that Webb can't be a decent LT.

The only outcome after that would be for Webb to be a swing tackle while developing. If he panned out, then he or Bushrod would be traded.

THe fact that they went after bushrod does not mean that tice is full of shit and doesn't really believe in Webb when he says he does. That's nothing but speculation.

I still hold a lot of confidence in Tice. He's a no bs kind of coach and I've always respected that about him. With that being said, I would think that one of his two projects will step up this year and do well, and I happen to think that is webb. My guess is that webb will be decent at LT (not probowl or anything, but servicible) and louis will end up benched with spencer at center and garza going back to rt. Who knows. The only thing I do know is that it takes a lot of assuming to think tice is blowing crap when he doesn't mean it.

Originally Posted by blinddeafmute

I accidentally said Clabo, when I meant bushrod.

What I was saying, and still makes perfect sense, is that Webb (and you even state it) is a project player. He has skill sets, but needs improvement to be a quality player. Obviously Tice thinks he can get there. Why else would he move him to LT instead of Carimi? The reason for making an offer to bushrod was for an immediate improvement. That doesn't mean that Webb can't be a decent LT.

The only outcome after that would be for Webb to be a swing tackle while developing. If he panned out, then he or Bushrod would be traded.

THe fact that they went after bushrod does not mean that tice is full of shit and doesn't really believe in Webb when he says he does. That's nothing but speculation.

I still hold a lot of confidence in Tice. He's a no bs kind of coach and I've always respected that about him. With that being said, I would think that one of his two projects will step up this year and do well, and I happen to think that is webb. My guess is that webb will be decent at LT (not probowl or anything, but servicible) and louis will end up benched with spencer at center and garza going back to rt. Who knows. The only thing I do know is that it takes a lot of assuming to think tice is blowing crap when he doesn't mean it.

OK, we're on the same page now. Yeah I would have used Bushrod as my starter and used Webb as a swing man and banished OMG to the 7th level of NFL hell. That's probably either Carolina or Seattle as it stands.

I love Tice as a coach but after JA left him swingin' in the wind in FA getting him zilch to fix his problems with he's had to back fill with what he has. He finds what he can to show Webb in a positive light and encourage the kid with his comments but privately he must have the same doubts about him that all of us have as well. He may have a few different camera angles to look at but basically we can all run the same play over and over again if we recorded it.

I guess what I'm really saying is that Tice's comments don't fool those of us who've watched Webb pretty closely these past two games. He's learning and he will get better but right now we're taking a huge risk on him.

Originally Posted by blinddeafmute

The twist you guys put on statements, and how you hang on every word amazes me.

I have one word. Development. You guys expect a late round pick to be perfect, and if they aren't you also have no expectations of improvement. Is it perfectly possible that they made clabo an offer for immediate improvement while Webb develops and then have a good left tackle to trade for picks? Yes. Is it possible that Tices comments aren't bullshit? Yes.

I would be willing to bet that that Webb will improve greatly through the season. Cwill will be a helluva lot better LG than he was last year. Garza will probably decline. Louis? Will probably improve and we will see what Carimi is made of.

Just thought I'd toss this article in from Biggsy brother. Jay Cutler supports you on this 100% and we KNOW that he doesn't bullshit. Fact of the matter is he hardly says anything at all. I guess if Cutler can be patient so can we. It's his ass that gets hammered every Sunday not ours.

Nothing spectacular, but no changes expected Brad Biggs
Print ThisSend ThisAugust 23, 2011, 11:40 AM EST
5 Comments



The last time Jay Cutler walked out of New Meadowlands Stadium, he left with a headache. The Chicago Bears quarterback was sacked nine times in the first half of a game last October, an NFL record, and suffered a concussion along the way.

It was one of the dumbfounding parts of the Bears’ season as offensive coordinator Mike Martz continued to call pass plays. So, the reshaped offensive line went into Monday night’s game against the New York Giants with plenty to prove. Left tackle J’Marcus Webb and right guard Lance Louis were under fire for poor performances in the team’s first preseason game. Line coach Mike Tice made it clear change could be on the way.

But in an entire half of action Cutler was sacked only once, on a play where he should have thrown the ball away. That’s opposed to four sacks allowed by the starting offensive line against the Bills a week ago.

“Yeah, upright?” Cutler joked when asked if it felt different this time around. “A little bit different guys right now up front but I think they wanted to come out and have a good showing. After we started a little shaky, those guys evened out and I thought they played a really solid half.”

The line performed well enough that no changes are expected before the third preseason game Saturday at Tennessee. Louis stepped up and that means veteran center Chris Spencer likely remains a reserve. It was going to take more for Webb to be yanked out of the lineup.

“Both of those tackles (Webb and rookie Gabe Carimi) are young,” Cutler said. “They’re in different positions than they were last year, but they’re coming along. I think if we would’ve had some OTA’s and everything, we’d be a little farther along. With the amount of practices they’ve had on foreign sides, I don’t think we could ask for much more out of those two.”

Follow me on Twitter: @BradBiggs
Brad Biggs covers the Bears for the Chicago Tribune

Originally Posted by soulman

Exactly my take on it too mo. If they thought all Webb needed was a little time to acclimate to the position then why go after a very young big dollar guy like Bushrod instead of a 30+ year old guy to just hold down the fort for another year. Matt Light would have been a good choice here.

Regardless of what Mike Tice says what I saw on Monday was a guy who is still struggling mightily with his stance and pass blocking technique. Tice raves about his "recovery speed" as if it was a gift from God himself but I have to ask "the emperor's new clothes" question, exactly what is Webb recovering from? Seems to me that if he didn't make a mistake to begin with there would be nothing to recover from. Am I missing something here? Is my logic flawed? To me recovery means something didn't go right to begin with!

I think right now if we had been able to land Bushrod that Webb would have made a great Swing Tackle because that's all the better he is right now and we still don't know if he'll ever get that much better than that. We know that Tice is gonna build him up in the press in order to boost his confidence but the eye don't lie. We went after Bushrod first for a reason and I'm thinkin' were about to spend the next four months seeing why.

It's unfortunate that Bushrod didn't fall into our laps like we had hoped. Our offensive line would be the shit had that happen. Our interior linemen have played pretty well, especially Chris Williams. Lance Louis is getting better by the week, and even Garza played better and called a good game last week than he did vs. Buffalo. I agree that Tice miscalculated when he opted to move Webb to LT. He (Tice) is so stubborn and insistent on developing Webb into a polished OT that he will do anything to accomplish the means to the end, including sacrificing what's best for the team, which would be to put Carimi in at LT.