I'm starting to despise Bears "fans".

**soulman** · 11-01-2011, 06:41 PM

Originally Posted by loki520

I don't understand it. I've been told, because I'm not from Chicago, that I never will understand Chicago sports fans.

Why, pray tell, do you get so personally wrapped up in a sports team that you simply can't enjoy yourself, or your fandom, without being "champions" or consistently in the hunt for a championship?

Sure, being a fan of "the champs" is awesome. But the losses and the hard times (take it from a fan of a team that was only 4-12 six years ago. Shit... 6-10 only THREE years ago!) only make the wins that much better.

Easy for you to say since the 2010 Halas and Lombardi Trophies both reside in Cheeseville right now.

Brother I lived in Green Bay long enough to know that there is a never ending quest for Super Bowl Championships there that just as strong as it is in Chicago. You may not have been pissin' and moaning about a 6-10 teams but a lot of Packer fans were even here in Denver. Of course they tend to triple or even quadruple in number out here when the Packers are winning.

Bears fans are known for their bitching about the team as are the Chicago sportwriters and part of that is because even though we have more total wins than the Packers we are second to them in World Championships and that history repeated itself again last February. Until that changes Bears fans will bitch. It's what we do.

Besides I don't think that God's honest truth observations of the shortcomings of your team, coaches and front office are necessarily negative. Honest and constructive criticism begets change. And now it's time for me to stay the hell away from this debate a second time.

**4th and 26** · 11-01-2011, 09:31 PM

Originally Posted by Nick

winning big games but not winning the super bowl. winning big games, but not going undefeated...it'll never be what some want. If this team played like the 85 Bears, they'd win one super bowl and under achieve every year after. people are gonna bitch no matter what...some of us take the good with the bad and just enjoy, others focus on the bad and play fantasy football with their team. "we shoulda drafted _____!!" "why didn't we sign ____?!?!?" whatever...it is what it is. Thank God we aren't the colts

This message board will never please everybody no matter what happens. Someone will always complain and someone will always disagree with other people but in the end we are all fans of a team. We all express ourselves different on this board and some will be tagged as haters and some will be homers, some will be fans and some will root for a team because they are good now. As a fan I bitch about Angelo a lot and I have done it for years. I think he made a great move landing Jay Cutler yet has done nothing in 3 years on building a supporting cast around the guy. I feel this organization is ruining this talented qb and it sometimes make me sick seeing other teams qbs stand in the pocket and throw to average wrs without having someone breath down your back. I personally want this team to tank this year just so fire Angelo and get the right staff in place to take this team to the next level.

**4th and 26** · 11-01-2011, 09:40 PM

Originally Posted by matsellah

An engineer knows more about constructing a building than I'll know in my lifetime. But if he builds a building and him and I are looking at it, and bricks are falling from it and it's tilted, I'll look at him and say "You suck as an engineer." And I'll be right.

Personally, I want The Chicago Bears to be mentioned in the same breath as The New England Patriots, The Pittsburgh Steelers, and yes, even those ... guys up north. I want to be able to talk with someone who supports another team that my team happens to be playing and have the ready confidence that my team will likely beat his team. Even if it happens to be one of those teams I just mentioned.

It would be nice to get a little praise from ESPN but I think the only way that happens is that we win our games in a more convincing way vs squeaking out wins.

**The Benjamin** · 11-01-2011, 09:52 PM

I said it before, I will say it again, win or loose, there is always something to improve. Our goal line offense is pathetic. And if you do not care that our goal line offense is pathetic, then talk to me next time we lose because we can not score on one of those plays. We will see if you still care about that complaint of mine.

**Riczaj01** · 11-02-2011, 12:18 AM

Originally Posted by Nick

well, we have to build a foundation of good before we can be perennially great. In the last decade we've been good, and the foundation to be great has been set. It would be nice if we could climb the hill and get to the plateau of being great, I agree with you there. I just don't know if it will happen under the McCaskey's regime.

The foundation isn't set yet; it's too inconsistant b/c of poor drafting. I agree it won't happen w/the Mck's there. I will give them much respect b/c this past decade they have really tried.

**Riczaj01** · 11-02-2011, 12:35 AM

Originally Posted by Wolfman

I guess that is the crux of the difference...I don’t feel like the Bears owe me anything; I don’t feel my long suffering entitles me to anything...sure, I want SB wins... but I don’t feel diminished or less without them; I am certainly not embarrassed by it...I don’t feel this organization is less or diminished without them either...we’re the God Damn Chicago Bears...we can go another 50 years without a SB win, and we’ll still be the God Damn Chicago Bears...I hold my head up high as a Bears Fan...proud and unashamed...Pitt and pack fans can shove those SB titles up their collective asses....they mean nothing to me...

No offense, but I think what you have said just points to why some of you can’t seem to enjoy a win as a win; that you will bitch and moan even in victory...winning on any given Sunday just isn’t good enough; you appear to need some kind of overreaching validation of your fandom; a validation that will only come with a SB win...multiple SB wins...that future maybe a long way away; you should try and enjoy the present when and where you can....like beating Tampa or chasing DET for a wildcard spot...

That is old world Chicago fan; and it's why the chicago teams were able to get away w/a sub par product for so long b/c of fans w/this attitude would show up and root regardless. But you have a new age of fans that grew up watching the Bulls make a dynasty in Chicago that they didn't know was possible in this city. On top of that, at the same time you had an explosion of games you could watch beyond your own team; and the media covered everyone. All I did when I was a kid was watch Pro level sports w/my dad, not just Chicago, so I saw how real franchises built and played.

No offense, but I think you spend to much time in TBS to know that I, win or lose, try(not always suceed, but try) to point out the good and bad in every game, and I think it's fairly balanced when it comes to the games themselves. I've been very negative to the F/O but for the most part they deserve it; but when they made a good move the compliments have always been there also. When this team wins I'm on a high the whole next week. When they lose I'm in the dumps for about 1/2 a day.
You can keep your cub's fandom mentality, we always got next year, for yourself, it's a loser mentality and I won't except it as being "a true fan". There is no reason w/the resources this team, or any chicago team has to not have a consistant winner. If I was a Pit Pirate fan, or a KC Chiefs fan or some other small market squad I would be more reasonable, but you have one of the largest brands in the NFL, you got money and influense, use it to build a consistant winner. There is no reason this team isn't the Yankees of Football; and there is no reason why 2 small market teams dominate in such a way in the NFL other then better ownership on down.

**Wolfman** · 11-02-2011, 07:56 AM

Originally Posted by Riczaj01

That is old world Chicago fan; and it's why the chicago teams were able to get away w/a sub par product for so long b/c of fans w/this attitude would show up and root regardless. But you have a new age of fans that grew up watching the Bulls make a dynasty in Chicago that they didn't know was possible in this city. On top of that, at the same time you had an explosion of games you could watch beyond your own team; and the media covered everyone. All I did when I was a kid was watch Pro level sports w/my dad, not just Chicago, so I saw how real franchises built and played.

No offense, but I think you spend to much time in TBS to know that I, win or lose, try(not always suceed, but try) to point out the good and bad in every game, and I think it's fairly balanced when it comes to the games themselves. I've been very negative to the F/O but for the most part they deserve it; but when they made a good move the compliments have always been there also. When this team wins I'm on a high the whole next week. When they lose I'm in the dumps for about 1/2 a day.
You can keep your cub's fandom mentality, we always got next year, for yourself, it's a loser mentality and I won't except it as being "a true fan". There is no reason w/the resources this team, or any chicago team has to not have a consistant winner. If I was a Pit Pirate fan, or a KC Chiefs fan or some other small market squad I would be more reasonable, but you have one of the largest brands in the NFL, you got money and influense, use it to build a consistant winner. There is no reason this team isn't the Yankees of Football; and there is no reason why 2 small market teams dominate in such a way in the NFL other then better ownership on down.

Yes, old school and proud of it...yes, I will be keeping my “loser mentality”...no, it doesn’t make me a “true fan” or a better fan then you or anyone...

I think...hell, I know we both want the same thing...whether you bitch and moan or I grin and bear it, neither is going to have any impact on making what we both dearly want to happen any sooner...what is is, and what will be will be...I am not going ring my hands, tear my hair out, or work myself into a lather over something I have no power over...at least not a daily basis, not over something I enjoy and love, and certainly not after a win...I am not going to make myself miserable over something that is supposed be fun and enjoyable...speaking of dads, my dad is a negative, miserable, self-loathing Bears fan; even in victory, I can stand watching a game with him...mabye that's why the negativity bothers me more then it should...

I am glad you feel you have balance; if I have misjudged you, I apologize...as I said several pages ago, the worst offenders will likely run and hide from this thread, and for the most part I believe they have...

**soulman** · 11-02-2011, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Yes, old school and proud of it...yes, I will be keeping my “loser mentality”...no, it doesn’t make me a “true fan” or a better fan then you or anyone...

I think...hell, I know we both want the same thing...whether you bitch and moan or I grin and bear it, neither is going to have any impact on making what we both dearly want to happen any sooner...what is is, and what will be will be...I am not going ring my hands, tear my hair out, or work myself into a lather over something I have no power over...at least not a daily basis, not over something I enjoy and love, and certainly not after a win...I am not going to make myself miserable over something that is supposed be fun and enjoyable...speaking of dads, my dad is a negative, miserable, self-loathing Bears fan; even in victory, I can stand watching a game with him...mabye that's why the negativity bothers me more then it should...

I am glad you feel you have balance; if I have misjudged you, I apologize...as I said several pages ago, the worst offenders will likely run and hide from this thread, and for the most part I believe they have...

I didn't run and hide. I'm just peeking in from around the corner that's all, LOL. j/k

Wolf, like you I'm "Old School" too. I can remember Mike Ditka as a player and George Halas as a coach and I once played golf in foursome with the Packers LB, Ray Nitschke. I watched these guys through the sad ass 70's and the championship level teams of the 80's. I watched Micheal McCaskey systematically dismantle in the late 80's what knowledgeable football men had put together half a decade earlier because HE wouldn't pay for great talent.

I watched Ditka get fired from the coaching job the Old Man had promised he could have as for as long he wanted it. Then we all watched Dave Wannstedt and Michael McCaskey set this franchise back 10 years with some of the most idiotic personnel moves I've ever seen. About the only person I've seen do worse is what McDaniels did to the Broncos because he did in a year and a half what took Wanny about 4 or 5 years to do.

And now I've watched Jerry Angelo make some brilliant moves only to follow them up with the stupidest ones I've seen in a decade or more. I've watched Lovie Smith coach the team to the brink of a Super Bowl Championship and then back into mediocrity in the years that followed and if we don't pull out wins in these next two games I'd say we're headed there again. I'm just tired of this 40 year roller coaster ride with these guys and how the team is run and I think it's ok to criticize that as long as I have something constructive to say in the way of solutions to this problem and right now one of those solutions is to,

FIRE JERRY ANGELO!!!!!

There, I feel much better now.

**short faced bear** · 11-02-2011, 11:23 AM

I think a underlying concept of all this is improvement. If there is improvement weather it's a win or a loss and a striving to get better both on the field and in the FO then I'm happy. As a long time fan you eventually want to see the payout despite how close you come. You do want to see that foundation laid and if you don't see it and you buy the product you have a right to bitch.

I wish to see a regime change and JA fired. But when they take the field I want them to win every time. Torn between wanting long term success with short term gain I guess. I just try to stay as even keel as I can.

Constructive criticism is a good thing. Perhaps some don't put it in a palatable form but if you look at it with an objective eye you can get a jist that some just wish for improvement and can't put a fine point on it.

**Blue Horse-shoe** · 11-03-2011, 06:54 AM

Originally Posted by Wolfman

Yes, old school and proud of it...yes, I will be keeping my “loser mentality”...no, it doesn’t make me a “true fan” or a better fan then you or anyone...

I think...hell, I know we both want the same thing...whether you bitch and moan or I grin and bear it, neither is going to have any impact on making what we both dearly want to happen any sooner...what is is, and what will be will be...I am not going ring my hands, tear my hair out, or work myself into a lather over something I have no power over...at least not a daily basis, not over something I enjoy and love, and certainly not after a win...I am not going to make myself miserable over something that is supposed be fun and enjoyable...speaking of dads, my dad is a negative, miserable, self-loathing Bears fan; even in victory, I can stand watching a game with him...mabye that's why the negativity bothers me more then it should...

I am glad you feel you have balance; if I have misjudged you, I apologize...as I said several pages ago, the worst offenders will likely run and hide from this thread, and for the most part I believe they have...

Yea cuz .. I guess that "for the most part" , those of us whose HEARTS aren't really into it as much as, say, the 'real' fans ...( who say 'oh well good enough' ) ..... have really gone and hid from this thread.
Cuz an 'oh well' heart is better. Wow. LOL.

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