Thread: Current OL Analysis & Offseason Implications

Originally Posted by MPBears68

A) If DeCastro were to fall to #19, all the better but that is unlikely and he's projected currently as a early-to-mid-teens pick. He may not even make it to #15. If he does, he will be easily the BPA overall in any plausible scenario. No one else carrying a grade in the 8s will make it to ~ #15. He is an 8.5 "can't miss" option.

8.5 Becomes a starter during his rookie year… A prospect who possesses physical attributes that will create mismatches and have an obvious impact on the game… Will become one of the premier players in the league.

No player with anywhere near that level of early true impact will even sniff the 2nd round.

There's more than a few OGs I see in the second round with absolutely stacked upside. Osemele, is just one of them. He is going to be an impact guard or RT. Show me a list of the 10 bets guards in the league and I'll show you a list of predominantly non-first-rounders.

B) What "larger holes elsewhere (including one in the same unit)" are you referring to and proposing to meet with a 1st round pick?

Do you really need a list? We have three solid starters up the middle, while we have an LT who statistically was the leagues worst. We were bad against the pass largely because of a hugely inconsistent pass rush, horrible CB play outside of Peanut and a completely unstable S situation. Jay was throwing the ball to one of the worst WR corps in the NFL. LB has two great starters and one position that has been in the "good enough" category for far too long. Give us an impact SLB to transition in as the aging vets are phased out and our D is better now AND in the future.

We don't draft CBs in the 1st ever and it's unlikely there would be one worthy of taking there anyway (Claiborne will be a top-5 and no one else rates above a 7.0). We have already discussed the LT issue at length so that doesn't look like an option for obvious reasons. We certainly wouldn't be drafting a DLman if we added Mario in FA to what we already have. And there is no WR past Blackmon (also a top-5) who has a snowball's chance in hell of being an immediate impact player either--the depth/value there is in rounds 2-3.

This one has always pissed me off and the C2 reasoning is just bullshit to me. I agree on the second part of that sentence (though Janoris Jenkins did his best to defy that at the SB, and Dre stands the same chance to get there as Decastro) but look how far not drafting CBs high since Peanut has gotten us. We're in a pass-heavy league AND division, saying we can get away with specialty CBs just isn't going to cut it any more. Especially when you look at how poorly it has worked out for us since Vasher went downhill. We need a truly talented CB as much as anything on D, IMHO, with our total lack of depth and Peanut's age.


C) I acknowledge that interior OL does not appear to be a glaring need in the immediate future on a superficial level. However, NONE of our current OGs are close to dominant players, 2 are coming off injury, and 3 (Spencer, CWill, & Louis) become free agents next year. The "great depth" you cite is temporary at best, even assuming that everyone gets/stays healthy, and our OL has been one of the NFL's worst on pass protection the last 2 years. Pushing the depth chart top-down is how to improve a unit.

I'm not seeing what your alternate preference is at #19...

My alternate preference, right now a pass rusher like Nick Perry tops my "reasonable" board. Give me Zach Brown who would be an absolutely huge boost to our LB corps before you draft an OG. Mike Adams dominated even Coples at the SB, and I would not hate that pick as much as I would a couple months ago. There's a few WRs who can re-solidify there mid to late round status this week, and I think adding there makes a bigger impact to our squad than to a position where we have adequate starters. Before his double hernia surgery, I would say Barron for sure, but that drops him. No doubt he makes a potentially huge impact at an unstable position.

I'd draft Cordy Glenn at 19 before I gave up picks to move up and grab Decastro. I just don't think interior OL is something I draft in the first unless we have an absolutely fortuitous FA. Decastro is a fantastic prospect, and I wouldn't be pissed if we landed him at 19, I just see zero sense in trading up for the deepest position in the draft unless we have an entirely unrealistic FA haul to fill holes at DE, WR, LT, CB, S and LB first.

Originally Posted by lklrlolnlilklsox

My alternate preference, right now a pass rusher like Nick Perry tops my "reasonable" board. Give me Zach Brown who would be an absolutely huge boost to our LB corps before you draft an OG. Mike Adams dominated even Coples at the SB, and I would not hate that pick as much as I would a couple months ago. There's a few WRs who can re-solidify there mid to late round status this week, and I think adding there makes a bigger impact to our squad than to a position where we have adequate starters. Before his double hernia surgery, I would say Barron for sure, but that drops him. No doubt he makes a potentially huge impact at an unstable position.

I'd draft Cordy Glenn at 19 before I gave up picks to move up and grab Decastro. I just don't think interior OL is something I draft in the first unless we have an absolutely fortuitous FA. Decastro is a fantastic prospect, and I wouldn't be pissed if we landed him at 19, I just see zero sense in trading up for the deepest position in the draft unless we have an entirely unrealistic FA haul to fill holes at DE, WR, LT, CB, S and LB first.

Agreed the trade up is too expensive/aggressive. I would not be angry if we did it and Emery thought that DeCastro was the next Hutchinson and a potential HOF.

But we have 1 All Pro and 1 HOF at the LB position so I would not draft Zach Brown by that logic instead of an OG we do not have a real need at LB besides youth. The interior OL is average on its best day and they may all be gone before Briggs and Urlacher go.

This team will go as far as Cutler takes them and our LB core does not help him enough.

The pass rusher is an interesting proposition and I would look hard at Nic Perry and a couple of others as the Giants showed you can never hit the opposing QB enough. My problem withe the DE class is that there are a ton of question marks. To me DeCastro is a superior prospect and will be a better NFL player that Ingram or Coples.

Originally Posted by WindyCity

But we have 1 All Pro and 1 HOF at the LB position so I would not draft Zach Brown by that logic instead of an OG we do not have a real need at LB besides youth.

I'm absolutely enamored with what Zach would mean to our LBs and D as a whole. It's a (should be vacant) starting spot where we have a well below-average starter that we would be filling with a stud prospect.

As for our interior. Admit it or not Chris Williams was an absolute game-changer at LG in all phases for us last year. Garza, who has been my unquestionable whipping boy since he came to town, played much better than any PFF numbers indicate. Spencer came on and surprised beyond all expectations before petering out with the rest of the OL down the stretch. The last two can certainly be improved upon, no doubt, and Williams' health can be worrisome. I still see Louis as a starter at OG, and at the very least should challenge Spencer. Having said that, I can agree we could use the injection of a stud on the interior as immediate competition, I just do not see much merit in spending the 19 pick on that unless we have a damn good plan to fix the issues where we have no adequate starter.

Originally Posted by omc1969

Usually players with LONG arms struggle with the bench press. I don't see it as a issue at all.

His arms were only 33", which while large for a C, are not the types of vines that I think qualify for that discussion. Gerhart has longer arms AND a bum finger and managed to put up 25. Only three guys with longer arms put up less than him, and we have seen guys with 35+" arms each of the past few years put up 30+. Yes, it's a factor, but not enough of one to not agree with Windy in saying that number is very disappointing. Especially when you consider Konz' on-tape functional strength.

Originally Posted by lklrlolnlilklsox

I'm absolutely enamored with what Zach would mean to our LBs and D as a whole. It's a (should be vacant) starting spot where we have a well below-average starter that we would be filling with a stud prospect.

As for our interior. Admit it or not Chris Williams was an absolute game-changer at LG in all phases for us last year. Garza, who has been my unquestionable whipping boy since he came to town, played much better than any PFF numbers indicate. Spencer came on and surprised beyond all expectations before petering out with the rest of the OL down the stretch. The last two can certainly be improved upon, no doubt, and Williams' health can be worrisome. I still see Louis as a starter at OG, and at the very least should challenge Spencer. Having said that, I can agree we could use the injection of a stud on the interior as immediate competition, I just do not see much merit in spending the 19 pick on that unless we have a damn good plan to fix the issues where we have no adequate starter.

I love Williams in the run game, especially when he is pulling and he may have been our best interior OLmen last season.

As a pass protector I think he is a little soft and plays unbalanced. I think he gives up too much ground in the passing game when compared to dominant OGs.

Williams to me is an average/slightly above average LG [Above Avergae RB, Below Average PB] and could be upgraded along with everyone else.

I would pick Cordy Glenn at 19 over almost all of the DEs in the class because too me his chance of being a bust is far smaller and he can still have a hug impact.

LT: Webb, I do not love it but this is a fact in our world.

LG: Williams/Louis, I would like to see some serious competition in camp at LG with Louis, the more physical player and Williams the more athletic player. It also covers us if Williams wrist, which is not a good injury for OLmen is not healed.

C: Garza/Spencer, They were both solid and unspecacular last season and I think that we need to seriously prepare ourselves for Garza's physical decline and the fact he may be best as a swing back up for a couple of season.

RG: Glenn, Our only truly physically dominant interior player in the mold of Carl Nicks. He is the guy who will be 1 on 1 in pass rush situations and the guy you run behind on 4th and 1.

RT: Carimi, the thought of Carimi and Glenn beside each other makes me tingle, and not in that way. These 2 could be they most devastating Right Side in all of football and could lead our rushing attacks for years.

*And if Carimi has to go to LT because Webb sucks and gets pulled. I move Glenn to RT and who Louis to RG.

Originally Posted by lklrlolnlilklsox

My alternate preference, right now a pass rusher like Nick Perry tops my "reasonable" board. Give me Zach Brown who would be an absolutely huge boost to our LB corps before you draft an OG. Mike Adams dominated even Coples at the SB, and I would not hate that pick as much as I would a couple months ago. There's a few WRs who can re-solidify there mid to late round status this week, and I think adding there makes a bigger impact to our squad than to a position where we have adequate starters. Before his double hernia surgery, I would say Barron for sure, but that drops him. No doubt he makes a potentially huge impact at an unstable position.

I'd draft Cordy Glenn at 19 before I gave up picks to move up and grab Decastro. I just don't think interior OL is something I draft in the first unless we have an absolutely fortuitous FA. Decastro is a fantastic prospect, and I wouldn't be pissed if we landed him at 19, I just see zero sense in trading up for the deepest position in the draft unless we have an entirely unrealistic FA haul to fill holes at DE, WR, LT, CB, S and LB first.

We obviously need a pass rush upgrade, no question. My scenario was predicated as written on making Mario our "splash" acquisition in FA with WR upgrades as well. Obviously if we don't sign a DE, then we have to draft one.

I love Zach Brown too as the best pure 4-3 OLB, cover-2 type prospect in this years draft IMO. He would upgrade Roach immediately and take over for Briggs when appropriate. He's also got rush skills which help too. I was focussed on protecting Cutler better, something we have done a poor job of for several years, as a slightly higher priority that's all.

The clear best way to do that would be replace Webb who we all agree sucks and hasn't justified the faith Tice seems to have in him. That was my original preference for the 1st pick. But, 2 factors seem to go against us there. Tice/Lovie keep saying "Webb is our guy" so unless that's a smokescreen it doesn't seem the team is going to pursue that draft option. And the second is that the class at OT is not very deep on 1st tier talent. I was hoping Adams could be that guy available ~ #19 but he has apparently not shined at the Combine depsite looking promising at the SB. If we have the ability to sign a FA who can at least replace OMG and push Webb, then great, hope so.

Likewise, Glenn has been impressive as an OG/RT prospect and will probably far farther than DeCastro. Another excellent potential option for the OL. Yes, CW played well and better than expected last year, I agree. But he does become a FA next year and he has a history of not staying healthy so this season will be big for his future with the team's plans.

Barron looks like the best SS prospect by far but I was prioritizing CB (where we really have no one all that good opposite Tillman) higher right now and figuring that re-signing Graham for ST/backup-NB and giving him a shot to compete with Major Wright at SS would be a compromise. We clearly need a CB in the top half of the draft unless we sign a FA which be much more expensive.

So, I did try to account for all the "holes on the list" in some fashion and was not at all ignorant of them in any way. There's a hundred variations that could make good sense in certain circumstances here.