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Thread: The Dline is Short Handed and We Need Lineman on Both Sides of the Ball

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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    The Dline is Short Handed and We Need Lineman on Both Sides of the Ball

    OK, vacation trip back to see family in "cheeseville" is over. It was a nice tension reliever but Packer fans won't have me. I told them now that we'll have Marshall and Bennett starting at WR and if they'll finally move Hester into the slot where he belongs Cutler will out perform Rodgers this year. For some reason they don't believe me, LOL.

    OK, with the loss of Okoye to the Bucs we're getting very short handed on the Dline and there's no realistic help in sight in FA. So...........let's stop all of this nonsense about drafting Colby Fleener or Michael Floyd and Kendall Wright or Stephen Hill. Admittedly they are all potentially good receivers but adding another with a high pick is a luxury we can no longer afford. Our Oline and Dlines both need some help early in the draft.

    Could one of these three guys end up becoming a Bear?

    Who is making their move up boards with under a month to go till draft night?


    DL Fletcher Cox: Mississippi State (6-4, 295)
    I think his best spot might be as a 34 five technique who is able to penetrate and make plays off the ball. He's raw and needs to learn to play with his pad level lower. However, as a potential five technique he's a guy who has the skill set to earn a starting role. (With the loss of Okoye who played at both DE and 3t DT last year might the Bears take a 1st round shot at Cox who seems to have the skills to do that same? He's been gaining ground lately and is seen as a potential top 20 pick. This guy may not have the upside of Mercilus but he's bigger, can play inside and outside and may be a safer pick. The guy has some real talent as a penetrator.)

    ICONMcClellin is a fringe first round option.


    DT Kendall Reyes: Connecticut (6-4, 295)
    Displays some natural talent and did a better job at Senior Bowl playing with a lower pad level. If he can continue to play lower should be able to fight for a starting role in both a 34 or 43 scheme as a three or five technique. (If Mercilus is still on the board at #19 I think there's a good likelihood we'll take him in the first and a guy like Reyes may be a good mid to late 2nd round pick as a 3t DT if we nab him. We haven't drafted Dlineman #1 and #2 since Tommie Harris and Tank Johnson but the need is there for both a DE and another DT and Mercilus then Reyes might be a good 1-2 combination. The OG and WR positions in this years draft are both deep enough to assure getting good players in rounds 3, 4, or 5 and given the current players we have on the roster at those positions it's not as likely a 2nd round pick at either position would end up becoming a 2012 starter as it would be a DT or DE. We could use youth to develop at OG and WR but quality guys can be found in the middle rounds. Especially this year)

    OLB Shea McClellin: Boise State (6-3, 258)
    McClellin is a productive pass rusher with a big motor, good skill set and can get after the QB in a number of ways. Looks like a potential starter at the next level. (If we end up missing out on Mercilus in the 1st and taking a guy like Cox instead would a guy like McClellin be a good pick in the 2nd? He's another "tweener" type hybrid DE/OLB like Perry or Bruce Irvin but he comes from a great program. He doesn't have Irvin's downside and unlike Perry, McClellin will probably be around in round two. I see the possibility of a high motor, non-stop Jason Babin type guy who can rush well and play the run from the LDE spot play in the rotation from day one. This is the kind of guy we've typically overlooked and he comes back to kill us when a team like the Packers, Lions or the Vikes draft him.)

    I know many will disagree with this approach but looking at the big picture tells me that one of these three guys has a good chance of being drafted in the first or second round by the Bears. Here's my reasoning.

    1) We've spent significant amounts of money so far in FA bolstering both the running and passing games. We signed a starting caliber backup QB. We resigned Kellen Davis for $6 mil/2 yrs and I think he's gonna surprise a lot of people once he's made part of the passing game again. Trading for Marshall to reunite him with Cutler was a master stroke for the offense. Marshall has been an All Pro WR in lousier offenses and with crappier QB's than he'll have to work with now. He's a solid 70-80 catch 1200 yard guy playing with Cutler. We also added Michael Bush who's a good power back and a very competent receiver as well so along with Bell and Forte we have one of the best backfields in the NFL.

    2) We added two excellent KR guys in Weems and Devin Thomas and both have the potential to get into the mix as reserve WR's. Weems could be a valuable slot guy who could team with Hester there and possibly push Sanz out of a spot. Thomas was a very productive college WR who just hasn't put it together in the pros but he's at that point in his career where guys like him either break out or flop as a position player. Let's hope for the best. The guy has the size we're looking for in a bigger body wideout and he has the kind of downfield speed we'll miss if Knox can't return to health in 2012.

    So indirectly and directly these two have the potential to add offensive and/or scoring clout two different ways as both return specialists and receivers. In addition they're both excellent special teams cover guys. They were an inexpensive way for Emery to add vet WR depth at low cost.

    3) I don't deny that LT is still a potential problem but overall I expect the Oline to perform at a much higher level this year than last. If for no other reason we get two of our best starters back and I agree with Lovie when he says that it's roughly the equivalent of adding a starting OG and OT in FA. Carimi and CWill are undoubtedly two of our best lineman. Louis can then move back inside where he was beginning to show real potential and we have two experienced vets in Spencer and EWill to provide depth at OC and OG.

    I don't see anyway to replace Webb in either the draft or FA now but that doesn't rule out finding another LT later in the year nor does it rule out the possibility of moving Carimi and/or CWill to LT to create competition in camp and preseason. In any event it's almost impossible to believe that Webb won't be at least marginally better this year. He'll have an entire offseason under his belt, no more 7 step drops to provide protection for, and some help from his TE's and RB's when needed. Bush and Forte are both rated very highly in that regard and Spaeth (if he sticks) or Andre Smith (better choice) are competent enough in-line blocking TE's to make a difference in pass protection now that Tice is running the show instead of Martz.

    Remember, we made it all the way to the NFCC Game in 2010 with OMG as our LT and there is no way that Webb can ever be THAT bad.


    I don't rule out taking a guy like DeCastro if he should fall in our laps in the one. No team in their right mind should blow a chance like that. The guy is an All Pro in the making. But aside from him there are no other Olineman I would take at #19 save those who won't even get close to falling that far. I'd also have no problem if we took a stud OG like Zeitler or Brooks in round two if those guys end up being a BPA choice. Even if an immediate need isn't there we still need to look at guys whose contracts are expiring after 2012 and start to plan for that.

    Personally I think the most foolish thing we can do is add more receivers (WR or TE) in the first two rounds. I know there are talented players there but the way I look at it is that's it's a luxury we can't afford now that we have committed to Marshall and we have other positions that need to be addressed in the draft on the defensive side of the ball. Guys like Nick Toon, Marvin Jones, Brian Quick, etc should still be on the board in rounds 3 or 4 and now that we've added Hayden and Wilhite for vet competition at CB we can afford to pass on that position earlier in the draft as well.

    We still need to add some talent in the mid or later rounds of the draft or UDFA at OLB and FS/SS and if a talented RB or TE drops into the 5th round or later where he tops the Bears board at that spot then maybe you grab him but the early rounds need to focus on pass rush and pass protection. With the exception of still needing to get Forte and Bell in the fold through tender, tag or long term contract we're a hell of a lot better off at our skill positions that we were a year ago at this same time.
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    Member VJ18's Avatar
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    after watching Cox game footage il pass, i seriously dont see 1st round worth he's getting, maybe a 3-5 rounder but not 1st. Id like us to get another DE and move Izzy between DE/DT (let him rotate)

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Gift received at 02-04-2012, 11:13 PM from Dagan81
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    To my knowledge Nick Perry's stock is still in the 16-20 range in the first Round. I'd pick him then worry about interior help in the second to third round.
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    I think our oline absolutely stinks and will stink even without martz scheme. But to ignore the defensive line would be foolish. I would like to see our first two picks adress our two weaknesses at this point and that is dl and ol. I'm not for going dl with both of our first two picks. That would be absolutely foolish and low impact move. And if Reif falls to us in the first damn the dl we can pick up situational guys later on. Same goes for decastro. I'm with windy when he says Melton is our starter at 3 tech so really just need a role player either waiver wire trash or third round and up guy no first rounder needed. De could use a younger guy to take over for izzy at that spot a legit case can be made we need a bonafide starter

    Other needs along the way that should be addressed IMO are wr s lb

    And if they really want to push this mess and garbage of an oline on us they better bring in another legit wr and not shuffle Hester ass out there so that our weapons can take pressure off the oline like lions and pack do it

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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VJ18 View Post
    after watching Cox game footage il pass, i seriously dont see 1st round worth he's getting, maybe a 3-5 rounder but not 1st. Id like us to get another DE and move Izzy between DE/DT (let him rotate)
    Cox won't last past round one. He's raw but he's got all the tools and the size to be a good NFL DT. Trouble is that he's a bit like Wilkerson was last year where no one knows for sure what his best position is. Some think he's an ideal 3t DT (which I kind of agree with) while other see him as a 5t DE in a 3-4. He's got the size for either and I think the key for him is to be in the right defense with the right team. If Mercilus isn't there when we pick don't be shocked if we take this guy.
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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by short faced bear View Post
    To my knowledge Nick Perry's stock is still in the 16-20 range in the first Round. I'd pick him then worry about interior help in the second to third round.
    I still like Perry and I'm getting a warmer fuzzier feeling about Mercilus. I think Perry has a better shot at playing LDE out of the gate but I also think Mercilus has the good to do it too. In both cases they need to keep some lead in their butts. Weight will be a factor in both cases.

    Because we lost Okoye that's what I think brings Cox into the picture and it all depends on what we need to accomplish. If it's strictly an outside pass rusher then I think Perry or Mercilus get picked but if Lovie thinks we need another 3t DT inside then maybe he'd lean toward Cox.

    The reason I threw these names up is because I could see us taking at least one of these guys in the first two rounds. Maybe it's Mercilus in one and Reyes in two if we double dip the Dline or even a combo of Cox in one and McClellin in two. Or another option is that we take a DT in one, and OG in two and hope we can nab Bruce Irvin in three.

    There's a lot of ways to go and I'm glad we took care of adding a couple of CB's and I'm glad we added STeamers who can double at WR. Those moves give us a lot more flexibility at the top of the draft.
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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by motownbear View Post
    I think our oline absolutely stinks and will stink even without martz scheme. But to ignore the defensive line would be foolish. I would like to see our first two picks adress our two weaknesses at this point and that is dl and ol. I'm not for going dl with both of our first two picks. That would be absolutely foolish and low impact move. And if Reif falls to us in the first damn the dl we can pick up situational guys later on. Same goes for decastro. I'm with windy when he says Melton is our starter at 3 tech so really just need a role player either waiver wire trash or third round and up guy no first rounder needed. De could use a younger guy to take over for izzy at that spot a legit case can be made we need a bonafide starter

    Other needs along the way that should be addressed IMO are wr s lb

    And if they really want to push this mess and garbage of an oline on us they better bring in another legit wr and not shuffle Hester ass out there so that our weapons can take pressure off the oline like lions and pack do it

    I was looking at one mags rankings of the top 100 NFL players at certain positions. Okoye was ranked in the top 30 so we did lose a decent ball player but Melton was ranked on the top 10 which kind of tells me why didn't stretch out too much to keep Okoye. He only got $2 mil out of TB so our offer must have been pretty low.

    No doubt Melton starts at one DT spot and maybe we see a lot more of Paea this year and we can get by with just Toe and another halfway decent rotation player. But you know Lovie and I know Lovie and the pass rush is his thing. It's what makes his defensive scheme work and he's not about to let that go without improving on what we did last year.

    So do we absolutely need Dlineman in one and two? No, but I still wouldn't bet against it if there are two guys there he really likes and the ones I posted here are players that i think will catch his eye in addition to the few who already have. All I'm saying is don't be shocked if we do double dip the Dline. Even after Tommie Harris fell to us we still went out and drafted Tank in the second so there is a precedent for doing it.

    If DeCastro is there at #19 of course we should take him. Only a fool passes up a sure thing that far down in the picking order. Reiff I'm not so sure of but it's probably a moot point. He'll go in the first 15 picks. Martin I don't want PERIOD and a lot of guys see Adams beginning at RT and not LT and then we end up with 3 1st round LT picks who don't play LT. I still think we're gonna find some help to backup or compete with Webb later this spring or summer.

    I think my point is that we need two Dlineman and at least one of those guys has to come in the first two rounds. In the first three I'd like to see us get two Dlineman and an OG then look for a WR or LB in the 4th. After that I don't care what we do because the likelihood of getting anyone who'd be of help in 2012 is very slim.

    It's a shame we couldn't keep Okoye since good young inside pass rusher aren't easy to find in FA and there is no question that losing him leaves us one short inside. Remember we lost AA too so it's not one but two DT's gone and at least one needs to be replaced. Past the 3rd round you can't hope for much immediate help.

    Heck I don't care if we take DeCastro in one and then take the Dlineman but I still say that we need some additional talent on those lines a lot more than we need another pass catcher right now. I'd bank on getting better pass catching help in the middle rounds than I would Dline help.
    I'm getting to that age where a lifetime warranty just doesn't mean as much to me anymore as an afternoon nap.



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