-
I agree with this. I like Tice, but am starting to think that his "I like my guys" attitute is a real problem in making a better team. If you are telling your GM that your guys are fine, he is going to give you some rope until he makes his own decision.
I agree that the line will play better this year, both because we have two valuable guys that are coming back from injuries and because the schemes have changed. But I still don't think the line will be a dominant line. You aren't going to address the problem unless you first see a problem. Right now, as much as I think Tice has been a big help, he is also being a problem.
I'd be happy to see the season start and these guys tear it up, but I just don't see it. I've seen glimpses of decency though and it may all work out. I think Tice has told Emery that with the guys coming back from injury and Webbs "potential" together with Tices Godly ability to mold Webb into an all Pro, that everything will be wonderful.
I have faith in Emery, and if things don't go the way that Tice has it worked out, I think OL moves to the top of the needs list for next year.
Right now (and it's stupid to make decisions before we have seen anyone even play a snap yet - but what the hell) I'd say if we were going into the next offseason we'd need OL, DT, S, CB. LB, DE.
That's a much better list than we had this year and some of those are more of covering for the future (LB) than they are immediate need. I say DE because even if Shea turns out to be great, I think we need one more in the rotation and Peppers won't be around forever. I actually think we could be ok at WR - which I am pretty surprised about.
Originally Posted by
4DaBERS 
Well, I have to agree with the majority in this thread that this article is poorly supported and there are so many holes in his logic that it looks like it's been hit with bird shot.
That said, I also agree with Jackie that everyone in here expected help for the O-Line in this draft. I was actually hoping for at least two, but none the less, that's how the draft falls. The point is, the underlying premise, regardless of how week his reported support is, is that our O-Line is much worse than our front office/coaches seem to believe it is, and I happen to agree with this premise.
We can speculate all day long that the additions of weaponry on the outside will help reduce Blitz packages, and that's probably true, but the majority of our sacks last year came from a simple four man rush. Our guys suck at picking up stunts, and many sacks just came from out playing our guys up front. It wasn't all on Martz either. Not all those sacks came from long drawn out 7 step drops. In fact, those plays were seldom used in our offense after about week 3.
The fact is, we do have bad players on our O-Line, many of whom would be lucky to make it off the practice squad in most other NFL cities. We can sugar coat it or wrap in in pretty wrapping paper all we want, but it's a very real problem and we all know it...don't we?
-
-
not worth reading... guy has no clue what he is talking about.
Bears Oline will be better
- we won't have Martz, who always had a bad OL with many sacks
- Ohmyfail is gone
- Carimi will be back
- Webb can only improve with a full offseason and all that stuff that comes with it
-
High Fives / Like - 1 BEAR DOWN!, 0 Dislikes
-
Originally Posted by
4DaBERS Well, I have to agree with the majority in this thread that this article is poorly supported and there are so many holes in his logic that it looks like it's been hit with bird shot.
That said, I also agree with Jackie that everyone in here expected help for the O-Line in this draft. I was actually hoping for at least two, but none the less, that's how the draft falls. The point is, the underlying premise, regardless of how week his reported support is, is that our O-Line is much worse than our front office/coaches seem to believe it is, and I happen to agree with this premise.
We can speculate all day long that the additions of weaponry on the outside will help reduce Blitz packages, and that's probably true, but the majority of our sacks last year came from a simple four man rush. Our guys suck at picking up stunts, and many sacks just came from out playing our guys up front. It wasn't all on Martz either. Not all those sacks came from long drawn out 7 step drops. In fact, those plays were seldom used in our offense after about week 3.
The fact is, we do have bad players on our O-Line, many of whom would be lucky to make it off the practice squad in most other NFL cities. We can sugar coat it or wrap in in pretty wrapping paper all we want, but it's a very real problem and we all know it...don't we?
These are good points. Not just the sacks either the hurries, hits, and pressures are also what bugs me. Louis, Webb, and Spencer really seem to have trouble using their hand placement (Give Spencer a pass b/c of his injury). These guys can improve but it seems like a forced development regardless and a bit of hubris by Tice on some of his experiments-Webb in particular.
Louis does impress me more at tackle than guard b/c of his feet. Even if they believe these are the guys to stick with I find it funny how every other position needs or gets competition but the OL which is one of the greatest areas of concern does not in terms of the draft.
I really hope to see more technical development from these guys. I think there will be some. I just hope any progress w/ real development isn't confused with masking by extra chipping, rollouts, audibles etc. They help obviously but smarts and technique will help a lot more.
Arguing on the internet is like winning the special olympics, even if you win your still messed up.
Restore the roar!
-
I heard an interview with Thayer on the Bears main site where he thought that the line was pretty good, but pointed to Webb as saying that he had to take a huge leap this year. I think Thayer knows what he is talking about and he has said Webb needs to get better, so either Tice thinks he can make that happen or someone is folling themselves. Personally, I don't think that having people help Webb is a real solution. With some DE's and schemes that can't be helped, but to say that we aren't going to have any problems at LT because we are going to give him help, is not a real solution.
This is going to be a pivital year for Webb.
Originally Posted by
short faced bear These are good points. Not just the sacks either the hurries, hits, and pressures are also what bugs me. Louis, Webb, and Spencer really seem to have trouble using their hand placement (Give Spencer a pass b/c of his injury). These guys can improve but it seems like a forced development regardless and a bit of hubris by Tice on some of his experiments-Webb in particular.
Louis does impress me more at tackle than guard b/c of his feet. Even if they believe these are the guys to stick with I find it funny how every other position needs or gets competition but the OL which is one of the greatest areas of concern does not in terms of the draft.
I really hope to see more technical development from these guys. I think there will be some. I just hope any progress w/ real development isn't confused with masking by extra chipping, rollouts, audibles etc. They help obviously but smarts and technique will help a lot more.
-
Just to be a bit of the devil's advocate here, but if "we" have faith in Emery and he has faith in the line/Tice's ability to improve them then we need to just let the draft go.
We also have to realize that Tice isn't the OL coach, Tim Holt is. Maybe he is actually better than Tice!?!?!?
Here is his bio:
Tim Holt is in his first season as the Bears offensive line coach after being hired on February 8, 2012.
Holt spent the last three seasons (2009-11) with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers working as team's assistant offensive line coach last year. In 2010 he was an offensive assistant coach for Tampa Bay, concentrating most of his work on the offensive line. He joined Tampa Bay in 2009 as a coaching intern during spring OTAs, concentrating on tight ends before helping with the offensive line during training camp and the regular season.
In the last two seasons, Holt has helped coach two Pro Bowlers along Tampa Bay's offensive line: G Davin Joseph (2011) and LT Donald Penn (2010). Over those two seasons, Tampa Bay's 4.5 yards per carry was the eighth best rushing average in the NFL.
Prior to joining the Buccaneers, Holt spent 14 seasons (1995-2008) coaching collegiately, including 10 working with offensive linemen. Holt started his collegiate coaching experience at his alma mater, Southern Connecticut State, in 1995, working two seasons as the tight ends/assistant offensive line coach.
He held the same position at Lehigh (1997-98) and Cornell (1999) before taking on the responsibility of running backs coach at Cornell in 2000.
From 2001-03, Holt was the offensive line coach/offensive coordinator at American International before returning to his alma mater to coach the running backs for three seasons (2005-07). Holt's last collegiate stop was Stonehill College in 2008 as the offensive line coach and run game coordinator.
Collegiately Holt played on the offensive line for the Owls for four seasons (1991-94) and was a three-year letter winner.
Winston Churchill:
"Since light travels faster than sound, some people appear bright until you hear them speak."
"If you're not a liberal at twenty you have no heart, if you're not a conservative at forty you have no brain."
-
High Fives / Like - 1 BEAR DOWN!, 0 Dislikes
-
Originally Posted by
GermansbombedPH not worth reading... guy has no clue what he is talking about.
Bears Oline will be better
- we won't have Martz, who always had a bad OL with many sacks
- Ohmyfail is gone
- Carimi will be back
- Webb can only improve with a full offseason and all that stuff that comes with it
I agree with all of these. Also, other than Spencer and Garza, these are all young guys who, at least hypothetically, could improve. We aren't relying on Rueben Brown a fountain of youth again.
-
Detroit, until this draft, didn't have a great offensive line, as it was basically the same unit from the 2010 season, and that team made the playoffs this year because the offensive coordinator (Can't remember his name, except that he used to be head coach of the Rams) did five step drops and ran plays out of the shotgun a lot.
Green Bay gave up 50 sacks the year before they went to the Super Bowl. The next year, obviously, they won the Super Bowl, but with essentially the same line.
So you see, any offensive line can improve. The thing that will help us out is that we can spread the field with our speedy and sizable receivers, and I really think that our ground game will continue to improve over even the last year when Carimi returns.
-
I'm getting to that age where a lifetime warranty just doesn't mean as much to me anymore as an afternoon nap. 
Honey Badger Don't Care. Honey Badger Don't Give a Shit.
-
Well, at least we know that, now past the hour of 4:00PM EST, the Chicago Bears as a franchise has gone down to meet Davy Jones in his locker.
-
Well here ya' go. This pretty much sums up all of the thoughts about our Oline.
“Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth.” -Marcus Aurelius AD 121-180
It was true over 1800 years ago and still holds truth today!
I'm getting to that age where a lifetime warranty just doesn't mean as much to me anymore as an afternoon nap. Honey Badger Don't Care. Honey Badger Don't Give a Shit.
-
High Fives / Like - 1 BEAR DOWN!, 0 Dislikes
LinkBack URL
About LinkBacks
Reply With Quote
Nuff said!!!!!! 