Thread: Urlacher Doubts Bears and Forte Close to a Deal............

Bears reportedly concerned with Matt Forte's knees

• By Dan Hanzus
  
• Writer
• Published: May 26, 2012 at 06:34 p.m.
• Updated: May 26, 2012 at 07:13 p.m.
  

The Chicago Bears obviously have hang-ups about giving Matt Forte a long-term deal, and now we might be getting a better idea just what they are.

The Chicago Tribune reported on Saturday that the team has "concerns over Forte's knees." The Bears are privately concerned arthritis could set in, leading to a chronic problem for the fifth-year back. Forte hasn't signed Chicago's $7.7 million franchise tender, and is sitting out OTAs.

Questions about Forte's durability aren't new. According to the Tribune, the wear and tear of Forte's knees drew the attention of multiple teams before the 2008 NFL Draft. The Bears were among that group, though they took the Tulane star in the second round anyway.

Forte, 26, rewarded the Bears by becoming one of the most versatile running backs in football. Last season, he finished with nearly 1,500 total yards, this despite being shut down the last four weeks after spraining his MCL in a game against the Kansas City Chiefs.

When you factor in this report along with the signing of the very capable Michael Bush, it's beginning to appear Forte and the Bears aren't a marriage built to last. Stay tuned.

Well, well, well this is certainly a new twist on things. I'd have a tendency to doubt it if the author hadn't referenced this coming from an article in the Trib. I'll look for it.

Here it is.

Forte's longevity a factor in contract talks Bears concerned how 26-year-old running back's knees will hold up

David Haugh's In the Wake of the News 7:25 p.m. CDT, May 26, 2012


Not sure running back Matt Forte noticed, but the Bears all but announced this week they now think they are a passing team.

Hardly able to contain his excitement at Halas Hall, quarterback Jay Cutler threw passes in the general direction of Pro Bowl wide receiver Brandon Marshall under the guidance of whiz-kid quarterbacks coach Jeremy Bates.



While Forte skipped the first week of organized team activities because of a contract dispute that the Tribune has learned includes concerns over Forte's knees, Cutler and Marshall took turns complimenting each other. When they weren't reminiscing about 2008, that is.

Is it worth pointing out the Broncos' leading rusher that season gained 343 yards?

Nothing about coordinator Mike Tice's newly installed Broncos-styled offense Cutler and Marshall described made anybody conclude it needs a marquee running back. It functioned at a high level in '08 with a running back committee, a point I hope the Bears avoid trying to prove in '12.

Anyway, despite Pro Bowl-caliber productivity in 2011, Forte picked the worst offseason to gauge his worth to a Bears offense in transition.

His value remains a source of debate and contention.

Eagles running back LeSean McCoy's five-year, $45 million deal with $20.8 million in guarantees was thought to provide a blueprint for Forte, who has yet to sign the one-year franchise tender guaranteeing him $7.7 million. It raised hopes to everyone who didn't realize that a five-year, $40 million deal with $20 million in guarantees was what Forte sought before a stellar season likely drove up his price, a source said. (Well here's the rumor on what Forte is looking for being mentioned)

Also overlooked was that McCoy is 29 months younger and has been used considerably less, a factor considering a source claimed Forte's durability has emerged as an obstacle during negotiations.

Throughout the league, people have wondered why the Bears can't agree on a multiyear contract extension for one of the NFL's most productive running backs. A major sticking point could stem from the Bears' worry over how long Forte's knees will hold up, a source suggested to the Tribune. The wear and tear on Forte's knees drew the attention of several teams, including the Bears, before the 2008 NFL draft when he came out of Tulane.

According to the source, given Forte's past the Bears cannot rule out arthritis setting in and becoming a chronic problem for the fifth-year running back with 1,237 career NFL touches who turns 27 in December. In the NFL, data show running backs start declining after age 28.

Those realities are one of several issues making the Bears reluctant to meet Forte's demands for the contract he seeks believed to be worth more in overall value and guarantees than McCoy's. Their concerns don't necessarily mean both sides cannot find middle ground before the July 16 deadline to agree to a contract. Frank Gore of the 49ers is an example of a running back with a spotty injury past who signed a long-term extension.

But if the sides finally agree, expect any compromise to balance understandable caution over Forte's knees and the Bears' wish to pay for harmony by rewarding Forte.

Trepidation over durability also could explain why the Bears have been so aggressive in signing expensive backups such as Chester Taylor, Marion Barber and Michael Bush in recent years.

Efforts to reach Forte's agent, Adisa Bakari, for comment were unsuccessful. The Bears don't comment on negotiations.

Forte has history with both knees. He tore the posterior cruciate ligament in his left knee in November 2006 at Tulane and that injury, combined with 833 carries in college primarily on artificial surfaces, caused a handful of teams to note worries over the length of his NFL career. He suffered a sprained medial collateral ligament in the same knee in 2009, his second year, and had postseason arthroscopic surgery.

In the midst of his best season last year, Forte missed the Bears' final four games after suffering an MCL sprain in his right knee. He then played in the Pro Bowl.

Even in an offense tailored to accentuate the strengths of Cutler and Marshall, Forte could perform at an elite level next season. Theoretically, Forte could skip OTAs and training camp and return in time to make an impact in Week 1 for a Bears team with every reason to think playoffs.

It's not what Forte might do next year that's interfering with a new contract, or even in 2013 when the Bears still control his rights by virtue of the franchise tag.

It could be the Bears' fear Forte doesn't have a leg to stand on when he contends he will be worth the investment as long as any extension lasts.

Forte is high mileage as a Bear. He ran behind some poor offensive lines and absorbed a lot of punishment prior to last season. Countless times he really made his own holes and just gutted out yards through effort and heart. But the wear and tear had to be significant with 300+ pound men beating on him.

I wish Forte the best. But I can understand the Bears not wanting to overpay a position at the expense of the overall success of the team. I heard the Urlacher interview regarding Forte. Urlacher understands that Forte is going to have to settle on a realistic contract.

OK, this is a first in a couple of different ways and here's what I picked up on;

1) Whether or not it's a bullshit concern you have to admit the Matt is a very high mileage back. I wasn't aware that he'd had that 833 carries in college. Add to that another 1013 carries as a pro and 224 receptions and that's a whole lot of mileage. 2070 touches worth. Yeah, there might be a concern over what he has left.

2) For the first time we've seen in writing what Forte is rumored to be looking for in the way of a deal. Haugh is 5 year/$40 mil/$20 mil guaranteed before the beginning of last season and possibly more now. Maybe more than McCoy's even and we've already had much discussion on that in another thread.

Well I'm still resting on my same thought. If the stats show a decline in productivity after age 28 then if uninjured we should still be able to expect 3 more productive years. So if we plan on tagging him for two years to avoid risk then why not just take a risk for three years and pay out all of the guarantees ($17 mil or the cost of two years tagged) by then. Maybe even over two years if the cap can handle it.

After that it makes no difference how long the deal is. If the rest of the money is simply salary, as it is in all of these other deals you can cut him without "dead cap space". In essence none of these deal that are being given out are 5 or 6 year deal because the guarantees run out after the 3rd year or so and the player can be cut or offered renegotiation. They're not really five year deals as advertised because all five years aren't guaranteed.

Matt does have to realize two things. Number one is what Urlacher said about no one getting what they feel they're worth. Actually to me that's scary statement coming from him in a contract year. The second thing Matt needs to realize is that his role in this offense will be reduced. If the Bears have to commit significant amounts of money to him you know damn well they're gonna slow down the rate at which he's being "used up".

So it's worthless to argue that he was 45% or whatever of the Bears offense in 2011. He's already been paid for 2011 and seriously underpaid. I'd be the first to admit that. He's being paid for 2012 now and 2013-whenever thereafter and at no point in the future will he ever be even close to 45% of the Bears offense again. It's his value to the team going forward that's the only thing under consideration and his role is being reduced.

If your under contract and being paid so much a year based on a certain number of hours put into work and the company tells you that in the new contract your hours will be reduced would you be surprised if they lowered what they were paying you? I wouldn't because it actually happened to me more than once.

Originally Posted by soulman

Matt does have to realize two things. Number one is what Urlacher said about no one getting what they feel they're worth. Actually to me that's scary statement coming from him in a contract year. The second thing Matt needs to realize is that his role in this offense will be reduced. If the Bears have to commit significant amounts of money to him you know damn well they're gonna slow down the rate at which he's being "used up".

So it's worthless to argue that he was 45% or whatever of the Bears offense in 2011. He's already been paid for 2011 and seriously underpaid. I'd be the first to admit that. He's being paid for 2012 now and 2013-whenever thereafter and at no point in the future will he ever be even close to 45% of the Bears offense again. It's his value to the team going forward that's the only thing under consideration and his role is being reduced.

I agree with your entire post, but the above two points are excellent. We were more of a one-trick pony offense, but this upcoming season we will have a LOT of weapons. Matt will be part of the show, but just a part of a much bigger picture. Maybe Michael Bush will also cut into his carries more than our previous #2 RB's.

Maybe that is one reason why he wants a long term contract so badly. If he simply goes the franchise route, and he has a fraction of the yards/receptions this year, then he may not be able to command as big of a contract (from any team) moving forward. He just won't have as much leverage as he does now. And he'll be another year older too. He also understands his body is high mileage (he's 26 in years only). He probably feels like his window of opportunity is now. Now or never.

Originally Posted by JustAnotherBearsFan99

I agree with your entire post, but the above two points are excellent. We were more of a one-trick pony offense, but this upcoming season we will have a LOT of weapons. Matt will be part of the show, but just a part of a much bigger picture. Maybe Michael Bush will also cut into his carries more than our previous #2 RB's.

Maybe that is one reason why he wants a long term contract so badly. If he simply goes the franchise route, and he has a fraction of the yards/receptions this year, then he may not be able to command as big of a contract (from any team) moving forward. He just won't have as much leverage as he does now. And he'll be another year older too. He also understands his body is high mileage (he's 26 in years only). He probably feels like his window of opportunity is now. Now or never.

Thanks brother. Sometimes this saying annoys me and I sure others as well but "it is what it is". Unfortunately for Matt he wasn't drafted as high as he may have been because of the same thing that's creating a roadblock here. His knees and his mileage.

I can understand his frustration but there are times when the circumstances surrounding you just don't fit your perception of how they should. I do believe the Bears want to do the very best by him that they can and show appreciation to guy who has performed above and beyond the call but they can't set themselves up for cap issues that can happen if he is seriously injured or his career heads south in big hurry.

Everything you said in that last paragraph is spot on. That's exactly what's happening but as you pointed out even Urlacher said that he's got to be realistic about his situation. He's not playing for any other team under their cap or the way they structure their pay scales. He plays for the Bears and that's the only team he can play for right now and even in the foreseeable future if they choose to tag him again.

The risk is there anyway up to about $17 mil if they tag him so logic tells me they see that as well and have been willing to bump their offer in that range. Wanting $20 mil plus in guarantees Matt thinks he being screwed in his efforts to land the one big contract he's ever likely to get. You read it exactly right. Now is his window and as time passes his value shrinks.

I think it's the same thing I've said to my clients over the years when I've asked them. Is there really a difference between being "comfortably rich" and "incredibly rich". If you've got all that you need and the money to buy all that you ever care to have what good does all that excess do anyway. At times wealth passed on can create as many problems as it solves when not done well.

So I ask them if they really want to take all that additional risk which it takes to become incredibly rich. Sometimes there's a lot of luck in that just like there can be in other forms of gambling.

What ever they finally settle on Matt Forte is going to be very comfortably rich. The money he makes this year will be more than 95% of us will make in a lifetime. The monetary difference in what's been asked and what's been offered is nothing to sneeze but sometimes you have to put personal pride aside and accept you fate.

He's never gonna get back the year he lost as he'd undoubtedly like to but if he takes that small fortune he's getting and does some smart things with it he can make it up and more that way. If he was my client the minute he got his first big check I'd try to make certain he bought a nice sedate SUV rather than a Lamborghini. Never put big money in depreciating assets.

Part of the problem for Forte is simply the position he plays. I think RB's are in a rough spot from the day they're drafted. By the time they play out their rookie contract they often have 1 shot at the "Big Payday" before they become viewed as being diminished in future contract value. They are often "old men" by the time they're 30. Sometimes their production drops off a year or two prior to that. With the speed and size of defensive players today, especially dlinemen, a RB simply has his body destroyed in a short span of a few years. You hear the stories of how some retired RB's who are not that old, have trouble walking or even dressing themselves in the morning - even with knee and hip replacements.

I feel bad for Forte. But I don't think it's the Bears fault that they want to not overpay a single player at the expense of the overall good of the team. It's not a charity. It's a business. It stinks.