Offensive Lineman the Most Difficult to Scout...............

**soulman** · 06-12-2012, 03:57 PM

Maybe this is what JA had such a tough time finding lineman. His scouting abilities were always pretty suspect as it related to the offense.

The most difficult position to scout

Finding the best offensive linemen is no easy task. Greg Gabriel
June 12, 2012, 04:00 PM EST

As I have said many times in the past, many people think that scouting is an easy job. Forget that thought, because it can be one of the most difficult careers a person can have. Scouts live a lonely life…they can be away from home for 180-200 nights a year. On top of that, you better be right about the majority of prospects you scout. If not, you can soon be on the outside looking in. With that being said, some scouts find it easier to scout some positions more than others.

For instance, I was a running back and so it was easy for me to scout running backs because I knew so much about the position. On the other hand, the position that took me the longest to feel comfortable about my reports was offensive linemen.

O-Line is a difficult position to scout because there is so much that goes into understanding the position. Not only are you looking for the general traits such as size, strength and power, but a scout also has to know exactly what his club's offensive coordinator and line coach are looking for at center, guard and tackle. What fits one team may not fit another.

Offensive linemen are a different breed. Unlike any other position group, they are a group that has to function as one; they are a sum of the parts. Not only does the player have to have the right physical traits but he also has to fit the criteria the team wants as far as personality and intelligence. In the offensive line group, if a player doesn’t fit in with the other guys, chances are he won’t play that well or may not play at all. In the meeting room, there is a caste system and the young player has to earn the respect of the veterans. If he is a loner or an outcast it can be difficult for him to be accepted by the older players.

The one common denominator that most teams look for in offensive linemen is intelligence. As a whole, offensive linemen are probably the smartest guys on a team. While they may be “nasty” on the field they still have to be level headed and be able to think on their feet. They have to be able to pick up line calls and switches in protection in an instant. If they fail to hear a call or bust an assignment the called play is dead.

The offensive lineman also has to have a high degree of football character. He needs to be a self-starter who is reliable. The lazy player just isn’t going to make it. He may survive for a little while because of his natural talent but sooner or later it will catch up to him and he will be cut because his teammates can’t trust him.
(I'd say so far that Webb has been a failure at all of the most important traits that a lineman must have. He's not very bright and I think he's a lazy player who has survived so far because Tice likes his size and athleticism but listening to Cutler you can tell that the trust just isn't there yet)

What to look for in tackles

Jackie Slater was an NFL Hall of Fame offensive tackle. (Walter Payton's main man in college)

Speaking in general terms, the ideal tackles would be in 6-4 to 6-7 range and weigh 310–320 pounds. There has been a tendency over the last 10 years or so because of the popularity of zone blocking schemes to draft taller players (6-7 to 6-8) but many of these players don't have the natural athleticism of a shorter guy. Tackles who run sub 5.0 40’s are rare, so scouts typically look for players that run between 5.0 and 5.3. That’s not to say that a 5.5 guy can’t play…he can, I'm just talking from an ideal point of view. The left tackle is usually more athletic than a right tackle because he has to protect the quarterback's blind side. He may have quicker feet, can recover more quickly and have more range. No matter what side he plays, you want a tackle to have long arms. 33” arms would be the minimum arm length but many teams prefer a player with 34 or 35 inch arms. Long arms give a player a leverage advantage, while the shorter armed player can have a hard time keeping an opponent off his body.

All offensive linemen have to have good bend. Straight legged players have a tendency to bend at the waist and fall off blocks. A good knee bender will keep his back straight and have a good base and balance. Balance is very important, a lineman can’t play the game on the ground.

Another common trait regardless of offensive line position is hand use. You want a guy with quick hands and a strong punch. You want the player to strike quickly with his hands and be able to recoil and strike again. Players who “wind up” are giving their opponent an advantage. You always want to see a player keep his hands inside.

Lower body strength is also a trait you look for in all linemen. Players who have “snap” in their hips to explode into their opponent and drive them off the ball.

Guards
Guards will generally have a little stockier build than a tackle. Ideal size would be from 6-3 to 6-5 with the player weighing between 305 and 320. While a tackle has to be a pass blocker first, guards have to be strong run blockers. Many defensive schemes in the league have huge interior defensive linemen and because of this, guards have to have to be powerful men who can get off the ball and explode into his opponent.

Obviously they have to have a very good degree of balance so they can sustain blocks and get movement.

While guards have to be strong run blockers, they still have to possess good pass blocking skills. The difference is they don’t have to be as rangy as a tackle. Tackles have help on the inside from guards but a guard has help on both sides. Still he has to have a good base with quick feet and a strong ability to anchor. If a guard or center can’t anchor the quarterback, he is in trouble because defensive linemen will be able to sink the pocket.

Depending on the offense, guards also need to be able to pull. He has to have the skill to get out of his stance quickly, turn, run and adjust on the move to a moving target. This requires good body control and a good degree of athleticism. In some of the zone schemes that don’t pull as often you can get by with a little lesser athlete.

Centers
Centers can be much like guards, in fact many can play both positions. The center in many cases is the leader of the line and makes the line calls, so he has to be intelligent and instinctive in order to make the right calls. In pass protection he has to have a high degree of awareness because he is often asked to help the guards with stunts and blitzes.

The ideal size would be from 6-2 to 6-5 and like the guards, weigh between 305 and 320. Because he often has to block the biggest player on the defense (the nose tackle) he also has to be very powerful…he has to find a way to move that player.

**soulman** · 06-12-2012, 04:08 PM

Gabriel's column might explain why there are so many highly drafted lineman who fail and others drafted later on or not at all who succeed. And some just function better in one type of blocking scheme than another.

I hate to keep picking on Webb but I've said all along that his problems are in his head, not his body. He's not a fast learner and he's constantly making the same mistakes over and over which kind of proves that he's not "getting it".

I also think he's a bit lazy and that comes from his lack of maturity and from having it to easy against poor competition in college where he probably dominated. And of course that last comment about earning trust really applies to him. Even though Cutler didn't single him out we all know who his biggest concern is.

**Riczaj01** · 06-12-2012, 04:16 PM

That's why I'd perfer to take chances on guys from the larger conferences, the competition they faced would have forced them to work on their game. Maybe not all positions...RB, WR etc. But OL and QB I'll take from conferences that forced them to excel b/c of the competition they faced.

**short faced bear** · 06-12-2012, 04:25 PM

This article reminds me of what Covert was saying the same thing about punch blocking and getting separation. I'm not sure what the balance drills or metrics are but that is something I don't see talked a lot about either.

**JustAnotherBearsFan99** · 06-12-2012, 04:33 PM

The one common denominator that most teams look for in offensive linemen is intelligence. As a whole, offensive linemen are probably the smartest guys on a team.

While they may be “nasty” on the field they still have to be level headed and be able to think on their feet. They have to be able to pick up line calls and switches in protection in an instant. If they fail to hear a call or bust an assignment the called play is dead.

I've read that the top scores on the Wonderlic test are usually offensive linemen. You simply can't play oline at the NFL level without being a very sharp guy. We think of it as a 1 on 1 assignment, but it is infinitely more complex than that. They often have 1, 2 and sometimes 3rd level blocking assignments. And with defenses being so complex now, this means the offensive line has to recognize and adapt instantly to what the defense is morphing into on a given play.

I also believe Chris Williams with his alligator arms will have trouble being a left tackle. There was a reason why they moved their "Left tackle of the future" to the guard slot and left him there. I have to believe the Bears don't believe he can BE a left tackle......at least not be a solid LT. So why move a great LG (C.Will) to where he may struggle? All I can think of is that we may be really screwed if Webb doesn't work out. It's a "house of cards" if Webb tanks. It will hurt our overall offensive line having to pull C.Will out of the spot he excels at.

**soulman** · 06-12-2012, 04:56 PM

Originally Posted by Riczaj01

That's why I'd perfer to take chances on guys from the larger conferences, the competition they faced would have forced them to work on their game. Maybe not all positions...RB, WR etc. But OL and QB I'll take from conferences that forced them to excel b/c of the competition they faced.

I agree with you. The Big Ten produces and has produced a lot of good lineman. I like these kids that come out of schools like Iowa, Wisconsin, and Michigan. We've had some good luck getting good lineman from those schools. Texas? Well the last OT we took from a Texas school was Stan Thomas and so far Webb has been a lot like him.

**soulman** · 06-12-2012, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by JustAnotherBearsFan99

I've read that the top scores on the Wonderlic test are usually offensive linemen. You simply can't play oline at the NFL level without being a very sharp guy. We think of it as a 1 on 1 assignment, but it is infinitely more complex than that. They often have 1, 2 and sometimes 3rd level blocking assignments. And with defenses being so complex now, this means the offensive line has to recognize and adapt instantly to what the defense is morphing into on a given play.

I also believe Chris Williams with his alligator arms will have trouble being a left tackle. There was a reason why they moved their "Left tackle of the future" to the guard slot and left him there. I have to believe the Bears don't believe he can BE a left tackle......at least not be a solid LT. So why move a great LG (C.Will) to where he may struggle? All I can think of is that we may be really screwed if Webb doesn't work out. It's a "house of cards" if Webb tanks. It will hurt our overall offensive line having to pull C.Will out of the spot he excels at.

I think the only reason CWill is competing for LT is that unless they move Carimi he's the only competition we have. Webb needs to be pushed so this is how they do it. I just hope if Webb wins the battle that they put CWill back in his LG spot and find another guy for swing tackle.

**JustAnotherBearsFan99** · 06-12-2012, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by soulman

I think the only reason CWill is competing for LT is that unless they move Carimi he's the only competition we have. Webb needs to be pushed so this is how they do it. I just hope if Webb wins the battle that they put CWill back in his LG spot and find another guy for swing tackle.

The competition is a good thing, but I wish they had a solid tackle to push Webb, and Chris could hone his skills and get reps at LG. I understand we have a lot of depth at the interior line positions, so that's a good thing. But it looked to me like Chris was becoming something special as a left guard.

Here's one thing that frustrates me. Linemen do need to work as a cohesive unit, almost like a single entity with 5 moving parts. For the Bears to continually keep shuffling people around on that oline is hurting us. Period. Tice knows this as well as anyone. So I guess we're pretty thin at tackle talent to have to pull Chris and move him. We just don't seem to have any decent veteran help at tackle.

Here's another thing that the Bears did under Angelo that just made me sick. We seem to value players who can play multiple positions at a mediocre level - rather than have players who EXCEL at ONE position. There is a HUGE difference between playing guard and tackle - even at the college level. It's like thinking you can use a screwdriver as a hammer. You can do it - but WHY would you do it? Go out and get a hammer if you need a hammer.

They should go after a decent veteran tackle to push Webb. A "real" tackle. This guy could push Webb - and if necessary be a starter for a year if Webb can't cut it (we're not going to get a "great" tackle this late in the off-season, but there ARE some decent veterans who could give us a season of work). Max Starks is still available. He's only 30 years old and is certainly decent enough to give us a year of work (or even backup, so we don't have to move Chris Williams out of his LG slot). Kareem McKenzie is 32 years old, but could have a year left in the tank. Obviously you don't want to do the "Orlando Pace" experience over again, but some oline players do play well at age 32. It depends on the player.

This is a problem that should never have occurred to begin with. I guess that's what frustrates me more than anything.

**soulman** · 06-12-2012, 07:53 PM

Marcus McNeil is another guy hanging out there if he can pass a physical with that neck of his.

I agree with you. The way they've moved CWill around is a poor way to treat the guy. He's not a bad OT just and inexperienced one but they never left him along long enough to gain that experience. If they would have just left him at LT to begin with rather than trying to find some place OMG could play by now maybe we wouldn't even be thinking about it but OMG couldn't play OG and we needed an OG so CWill gets moved.

In effect that's the same thing that's happening now. We need better play at LT so once again he gets moved back to the spot he was drafted to play in the first place. If JA would ever have had the balls to trace up rather than back to collect players who did us no good anyway he would have jumped in front of Denver and gotten Clady like he wanted. Just one more example of bad drafting.

**4DaBERS** · 06-12-2012, 08:49 PM

Let me just say, that as an O-Line aficionado I completely agree with everything Gabriel said in his article, and I have found nothing in this entire thread that I disagree with. Great start by Gabriel and great/intelligent discussion throughout the thread. Damn, I'm glad I found this place.

Gabriel is absolutely right (at least from my couch potato perspective) that O-Line has to be the most difficult position to scout, not only for all the reasons he stated, but since the 5 guys DO have to play as a unit, it's not always easy to determine who was at fault with a busted play unless you know the called play and the type of offense the team runs. Now obviously a Scout is going to have some of that information as well as game tape to watch over and over, so if he doesn't have first hand knowledge of a play, he can probably figure it out after reviewing it closely 4 or 5 time. It's rather elementary that OT's are easier as they are on the outside, especially in pass blocking plays, but the farther interior one goes, the more convoluted the whole review can become.

By the way, where has Windy gone? He should jump into this.

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