The LB's looked really solid Saturday. Roach especially.

I've been pretty critical of Roach, mostly thinking of the 2009 version of Roach who filled in when Urlacher went down that year.

But this 2012 version of Roach is decent. No, he's not Urlacher, but that combo of, Briggs-Roach-Hayes, looked solid. They look quick/fast but just not very big. Hayes is really on the small size. But I am so glad we picked him up. It will be interesting to see how this LB corps performs against the Giants.

I've been too harsh criticizing Roach. Sometimes I forget that players can get better. My gut feeling is that Webb has improved too. He sure looked better Saturday night.

So I live in VA and have to listen to Redskins radio and how high the town gets every year on their team. When that RB trucked Briggs well let's just say they are still talking about that here and want a Pro Bowl for that RB already.

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Originally Posted by Bear Goggles

So I live in VA and have to listen to Redskins radio and how high the town gets every year on their team. When that RB trucked Briggs well let's just say they are still talking about that here and want a Pro Bowl for that RB already.

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Even Urlacher gets trucked occasionally. It happens. Let them enjoy 1 decent play in a meaningless pre-season game. The Deadskins are going nowhere this year. Their 1st team vs our 1st team looked like we were imposing our will on them, other than that blown special teams play.

Roach is not a bad ball player and certainly one of the better FA finds of the JA era. Of course he's a defensive player and it was seldom a problem for JA to find them.

I think the best thing that we can say about him as that he's gotten better each year. His playing has progressed and after we lost Pisa we needed that from him. We don't have a guy on the team that can match Urlacher skills set at MLB but Roach is smart enough and experienced enough now to run this defense and keep us in the hunt and he can tackle and cover pretty well so we can get by with him as needed.

The Geno Hayes pickup is looking better all the time. I know we were all looking for Emery to make some kind of a move for a LB this past spring and when nothing happened to begin I think we were all a little stunned. But he waited and found a guy who knew the system well and who could be plugged in at either SAM or WILL and play day one. Another subtle but very important score for Mr. Emery.

Urlacher will play but the question how well and for how many games before maybe he needs a week or two off to rest that knee. I think it's kind of nice knowing we're four deep as far as NFL caliber starters go and that we have a couple of really good young prospects in DeCicco and Thomas behind those guys.

LB looks much better going into 2012 than in 2011 with the exception of Urlacher's injury and we're just gonna have to live with that just like he gonna have to.

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Originally Posted by soulman

Roach is not a bad ball player and certainly one of the better FA finds of the JA era. Of course he's a defensive player and it was seldom a problem for JA to find them.

I think the best thing that we can say about him as that he's gotten better each year. His playing has progressed and after we lost Pisa we needed that from him. We don't have a guy on the team that can match Urlacher skills set at MLB but Roach is smart enough and experienced enough now to run this defense and keep us in the hunt and he can tackle and cover pretty well so we can get by with him as needed.

The Geno Hayes pickup is looking better all the time. I know we were all looking for Emery to make some kind of a move for a LB this past spring and when nothing happened to begin I think we were all a little stunned. But he waited and found a guy who knew the system well and who could be plugged in at either SAM or WILL and play day one. Another subtle but very important score for Mr. Emery.

Urlacher will play but the question how well and for how many games before maybe he needs a week or two off to rest that knee. I think it's kind of nice knowing we're four deep as far as NFL caliber starters go and that we have a couple of really good young prospects in DeCicco and Thomas behind those guys.

LB looks much better going into 2012 than in 2011 with the exception of Urlacher's injury and we're just gonna have to live with that just like he gonna have to.

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I totally agree with all of that. Also, why do we often "label" a guy as no-good, or a bust, and fail to realize that young NFL players do evolve and get better. I'm guilty of this too often myself. It's like a player is "defined" by that snapshot in time when we may watch a young player have a rough beginning season and pronounce judgement on the guy as a bust.

Sometimes they end up being busts. But all too often they DO get better over those first 2 or 3 years, and become solid NFL players. They don't have to be pro-bowl players to still be valuable (and in the case of Roach, extremely valuable right now). We often see this with dline and oline players. Some (not all but some) can mature into pretty solid players. But the fans (and I include myself here) we want that "instant gratification" of seeing a player looking great that first year, and we crucify a guy if he bumbles along in those first few seasons looking rough.

I think our line guru's (Marinelli & Tice) are wise to give young players a chance to develop.

I agree with you both. Those few guys that can put things together in the fist two years are able to match up world class athleticism with a very complex game. People like that are very, VERY rare. The rest are simply exceptional athletes that have to work at being smarter about the game to become starter material, and that is something that is something that must be experienced, and thus, by definition, takes time.

That's exactly the point I've been making about Webb. I like very little about his game over the last two years, and I have real questions about his ability to get better, but that doesn't mean he can't or wont. Experience, in any occupation, makes you better. The only question is, how MUCH better can it make them. To be honest, I was so busy trying to focus on the O-Line during the last game, that when our Defense was on the field, I just sat back and enjoyed without focusing on any one player, so I guess I didn't notice how well Roach played. However, I didn't notice him get burned, so that's a good thing.

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Originally Posted by 4DaBERS

I agree with you both. Those few guys that can put things together in the fist two years are able to match up world class athleticism with a very complex game. People like that are very, VERY rare. The rest are simply exceptional athletes that have to work at being smarter about the game to become starter material, and that is something that is something that must be experienced, and thus, by definition, takes time.

That's exactly the point I've been making about Webb. I like very little about his game over the last two years, and I have real questions about his ability to get better, but that doesn't mean he can't or wont. Experience, in any occupation, makes you better. The only question is, how MUCH better can it make them. To be honest, I was so busy trying to focus on the O-Line during the last game, that when our Defense was on the field, I just sat back and enjoyed without focusing on any one player, so I guess I didn't notice how well Roach played. However, I didn't notice him get burned, so that's a good thing.

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I agree 100% with all of that. Regarding Webb's progress, I started a thread a few minutes ago on his improvement here:

http://www.dabears.com/showthread.ph...lid-year-at-LT

We may not like to admit it, but Webb is improving. Which is a "good thing" for us and our season.

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Originally Posted by JustAnotherBearsFan99

I agree 100% with all of that. Regarding Webb's progress, I started a thread a few minutes ago on his improvement here:

http://www.dabears.com/showthread.ph...lid-year-at-LT

We may not like to admit it, but Webb is improving. Which is a "good thing" for us and our season.

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It certainly is. Let me be honest, I've been critical of Webb myself, sometimes very much so. However, I do not think I have ever, in my 40 plus years of watching the Beloved, wanted to be so wrong about a player. IF Webb can make himself into a solid and dependable LT for this team, that by itself would be HUGE for this O-Line. OG upgrades are FAR easier and cheaper to make. So with that said, I have nothing personal against the kid and I want him to do well. Actually, I do have one personal thing against him:

DISSOLVE WEBB-NATION AND THOSE STUPID T-SHIRTS!:smile:

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Originally Posted by JustAnotherBearsFan99

I totally agree with all of that. Also, why do we often "label" a guy as no-good, or a bust, and fail to realize that young NFL players do evolve and get better. I'm guilty of this too often myself. It's like a player is "defined" by that snapshot in time when we may watch a young player have a rough beginning season and pronounce judgement on the guy as a bust.

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That's true, I'm guilty as well. But the problem is we've been subjected to guys like miller, metcalf and OMG and a few others that never got better, and probably got worse. So it's an ingrained auto-response issue. Once we see them play bad, they're labeled and that's that.

When you need a guy to play good now, you can't wait for him to improve over the years. We need to protect Cutler this year. If Webb can't do it, we need to get somebody who can. Cutler's brain can't take too many more blind-side sacks while Webb learns his trade.

Roach is another story. He HAS gotten better. I don't know that I've ever considered him bad, just not Urlacher.

Must have watched a different game than you all because Roach was constantly the last LB to react to the rush, always getting sucked up in redirects and beaten to the sideline more than a few times. He's garbage.