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Thread: Feisty Jay is right Jay for Bears

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    Certified Oline Zealot JustAnotherBearsFan99's Avatar
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    Feisty Jay is right Jay for Bears


    I like the engaged and animated Cutler, even if it's over-the-top. It seems to be naturally who he is. What I didn't like was the Cutler from a couple of years ago who would sit by himself, pouting, at the end of the bench after throwing a pick. I know the Bears defensive players hated it, too, because it suggested to them he was detached from the rest of the team, unaccountable. Getting after Webb and Tice was anything but that.

    Michael Wilbron makes some excellent points in this article that are worth considering. I was really turned off by Cutler's actions with Webb and Tice, but, this writer makes some excellent points that were made by posters here on the forum. Points that I didn't agree with a few days ago, but maybe they do have some validity.

    Maybe we need to "thing outside the box" more with Cutler. Maybe if this "is who he is" and the team is responding well, then it's a "good thing" and we're OK.

    He's just not the typical QB we're used to seeing in the NFL. But then again, Jim McMahon was pretty different too, and when he was healthy, he sure was a great weapon for the team to have (no saying McMahon is Cutler by any means, just that they both "march to a different drummer" and do their own thing).

    LINK to the article

    Feisty Jay is right Jay for Bears

    Chicago is better off with some creative tension from its quarterback

    By Michael Wilbon | ESPNChicago.com

    Apparently it's been so long now people have forgotten that December Monday night in 1985 at the Orange Bowl in Miami when the Chicago Bears lost the only game of their greatest season.
    OK, it's not the loss that's important to this discussion but the drama, specifically the halftime dustup featuring Mike Ditka and Buddy Ryan. To recap: Ryan was trying to cover the Miami Dolphins' explosive receiver, Nat Moore, with linebacker Wilber Marshall. It wasn't working, but that didn't dissuade Ryan one bit. So an enraged Ditka told his defensive coordinator, "We can do it any way you want to. We can go right out back and get it on or you can shape your (butt) up."


    [+] Enlarge

    Jay Cutler goes into Sunday's game against the Jaguars coming off his second-best passer rating as a Bear (140.1).


    Which brings me to Jay Cutler and Mike Tice and their little episode on Monday night in Dallas. In the age of relentless Facebook posts and anybody with a pair of thumbs tweeting after every down, an annoyed quarterback walking away from his coach in a heated moment during a football game equals an enormously big deal, to be chewed on all week.

    OK, it can't be ignored when former Bear Desmond Clarktweets during the game, as was reported by ESPN.com's Kevin Seifert, "Jay has to stop with his antics." Because Cutler's got a bad behavior video reel now and because he walked away from Tice on national television during MNF, Cutler's taken some shots this week.
    I'm just not sure he should.

    Look, it's fair to wonder if a quarterback with Cutler's demeanor can lead a team to a Super Bowl because when have we seen a sourpuss QB do it? But suppose Cutler jumping people now and then actually works for the Bears? Hasn't J'Marcus Webb played better since that whole screaming, bumping thing with Cutler in Green Bay? I'm just asking. For that matter, didn't the Bears begin a five-game winning streak last season after Cutler dropped that F-bomb on Mike Martz, which led to the offensive coordinator calling much smarter plays? I'm just asking. Didn't the Bears offense get a whole lot better Monday night after Cutler blew off Tice for a few minutes?

    I guess you can call these coincidences until we get a larger sample size. But if it keeps working, you shrug and let Cutler keep doing his thing, even if he does look petulant or sour during games. But the larger issue here is the presumption that everybody on a team has to hold hands and sing "Kum Ba Yah" every day. That's nonsense. Folks who've followed the Bears really should know better.

    Ditka was ready to meet Ryan out behind the Orange Bowl to duke it out. At least one Pro Bowler I know of on that team couldn't stand Jim McMahon. It didn't matter. It never does if you win. Chemistry is such a mysterious thing. Maybe Webb plays better if he's annoyed with Cutler. Maybe Cutler has a better feel for play calling than Tice, and had every right to be impatient. Maybe Cutler is the excitable ying to Lovie Smith's flat-line yang.






    I like the engaged and animated Cutler, even if it's over-the-top. It seems to be naturally who he is. What I didn't like was the Cutler from a couple of years ago who would sit by himself, pouting, at the end of the bench after throwing a pick. I know the Bears defensive players hated it, too, because it suggested to them he was detached from the rest of the team, unaccountable. Getting after Webb and Tice was anything but that.
    And also well taken is Cutler's assertion on ESPN 1000 last week, "If I yell on the sideline I get killed. If I don't say anything I get killed. If I walk away I get killed. It's a no-win situation."

    Anybody who can remember the daily goings-on of the '85 Bears and '96 Bulls, the two greatest teams in Chicago sports history and perhaps the greatest football and basketball teams in the history of sports in America, should know better than to invest too heavily in the notion that vanilla behavior is necessary to win championships.

    Those Bulls, remember, had Dennis Rodman, who in the middle of that historic 72-win season, asked for and was granted days off to go to Las Vegas. Rodman, if that team was playing now, would monopolize Twitter sports conversation. Can you imagine the depth and volume of the coverage now if a celebrity as big as Rodman was just to show up in Vegas during the middle of a historic season? As smart a player as Rodman was, he was two handfuls to manage and it took every moment of Zen Phil Jackson could muster plus enormous assistance from Michael Jordan, on a daily basis, to keep Rodman in line and make the whole thing work.

    You think Jackson, Jordan, Rodman and Scottie Pippen didn't walk away from one another, annoyed as hell during a game?


    [+] Enlarge

    A feisty Jay Cutler is better than a pouting Jay Cutler.


    Cutler, by the way, wound up playing his best game by far this season in Dallas, and it really didn't get started until after blowing off Tice. Perhaps Tice, embarrassed as he must have felt, has to simply grit his teeth and take one for the team. What, Tice never embarrassed a player in the 16 years he's been coaching in the NFL? Never went back at an assistant coach during his 13-year NFL playing career? Spare me the "poor Mike Tice" rant, as if Cutler so humiliated Tice that he can't function at capacity going forward. Nonsense. If Tice wants to grab Cutler by the collar the next time in response, then Cutler will vent or walk at his own risk. Why should anybody confuse professional football with the Glee Club?

    Creative tension may be exactly the elixir that gives the Bears real chemistry.

    In the meantime, the most impressive thing about the Bears, post-game, may have been the calm of the locker room after throttling the Cowboys in Dallas. There wasn't a strut or a jersey pop in the room. The Bears acted like they'd just finished a mid-week practice, which bodes well for Jacksonville on Sunday, anyway, that they didn't waste time celebrating a third win of the season.

    Maybe the offense will function in a way that Cutler won't need to jump anybody, teammate or coach. If he does, that would be a helluva lot better than acting like nothing happened.

    I liked the Cutler I saw Monday night in Dallas, the 275 passing yards, two touchdowns thrown, even taking exception with Tice. Most people saw in that act a lack of leadership. But I'm allowing, at least for now, for the possibility that Cutler was showing leadership, at least in his unorthodox way. The only thing he needs to do afterward is own it, step to the mic after the game and say, "Yeah, I was ticked off at Coach Tice in the moment, but we're done with it now."

    If walking away from an assistant coach in the competitive heat of a game is the biggest criticism of Jay Cutler over the next few weeks the Bears could be onto something.
    Last edited by JustAnotherBearsFan99; 10-05-2012 at 10:37 AM.
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    Certified Oline Zealot JustAnotherBearsFan99's Avatar
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Gift received at 04-16-2013, 02:27 PM from weneedmorelinemen
Message: Here you go, buddy.  Wear it with pride.GameballBears Head LogoGeorge Halas

    Anybody who can remember the daily goings-on of the '85 Bears and '96 Bulls, the two greatest teams in Chicago sports history and perhaps the greatest football and basketball teams in the history of sports in America, should know better than to invest too heavily in the notion that vanilla behavior is necessary to win championships.
    qft.

    Maybe he's the "Anti-Lovie" personality that we need in Chicago. Nothing against Lovie's "Wooden Indian" look, and monotone 1-liners that we've heard every year over-and-over again, but a dose of Jay Cutler may be good for us.

    And the team.
    Last edited by JustAnotherBearsFan99; 10-05-2012 at 01:48 PM.
    Trestman - Kromer - Tucker - DeCamillis

    I'm looking forward to seeing these guys coach. Hope they're good.


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    Junior Member inchibearfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustAnotherBearsFan99 View Post
    qft.

    Maybe he's the "Anti-Lovie" personality that we need in Chicago. Nothing against Lovie's "Wooden Indian" look, and monotone 1 liners that we've heard every year over-and-over again, but a dose of Jay Cutler may be good for us.

    And the team.
    You have to wonder at times if they do not play with that fire/edge that they need to win. Lovie is not producing it with his coaching style (I'm not saying that is bad) but like you said, Cutler evens the team out on the other side. After so many times it stops being a coincidence and starts becoming a trend.

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    Member Shark86x's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by inchibearfan View Post
    You have to wonder at times if they do not play with that fire/edge that they need to win. Lovie is not producing it with his coaching style (I'm not saying that is bad) but like you said, Cutler evens the team out on the other side. After so many times it stops being a coincidence and starts becoming a trend.
    I really don't mind Lovie's deer inthe headlights look too much. It's good for the players when all heck is breaking loose to have the coach remain cool, calm and collected. But there has to be somebody to light a fire when it's needed. That's not Lovie. I'm glad Jay is stepping up in that department.

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    Certified Oline Zealot JustAnotherBearsFan99's Avatar
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Gift received at 04-16-2013, 02:27 PM from weneedmorelinemen
Message: Here you go, buddy.  Wear it with pride.GameballBears Head LogoGeorge Halas
    It wasn't until I read that article, that I began thinking back to how McMahon and Ditka were always fueding (sometimes not even speaking to each other for a few weeks). In addition to that, Ditka hated Buddy Ryan (and vise versa).

    And yet, they made it all work. In fact, it made the team more interesting to me at the time. The winning was great, but all of the bigger-than-life personalities made for an interesting season too.

    I'm not saying this team is that team. But I am re-thinking this Cutler thing now. Thinking back to those fiery personalities from the Bears past, helped me "connect the dots" here. All I want is for us to win.
    Last edited by JustAnotherBearsFan99; 10-05-2012 at 01:47 PM.
    Trestman - Kromer - Tucker - DeCamillis

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    The author makes a good point, but I still do not like the attitude from the little media inflated bits I have seen.

    I don't know Jay, but he sure appears to be an asshole. I'm not his fan, and that's okay.
    I'll just keep rooting for the receivers and the team.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JustAnotherBearsFan99 View Post
    qft.

    Maybe he's the "Anti-Lovie" personality that we need in Chicago. Nothing against Lovie's "Wooden Indian" look, and monotone 1-liners that we've heard every year over-and-over again, but a dose of Jay Cutler may be good for us.

    And the team.
    Quote Originally Posted by JustAnotherBearsFan99 View Post
    It wasn't until I read that article, that I began thinking back to how McMahon and Ditka were always fueding (sometimes not even speaking to each other for a few weeks). In addition to that, Ditka hated Buddy Ryan (and vise versa).

    And yet, they made it all work. In fact, it made the team more interesting to me at the time. The winning was great, but all of the bigger-than-life personalities made for an interesting season too.

    I'm not saying this team is that team. But I am re-thinking this Cutler thing now. Thinking back to those fiery personalities from the Bears past, helped me "connect the dots" here. All I want is for us to win.

    LOL, if I said that I'm glad you're coming around to a more liberal way of thinking as far a Jay Cutler is concerned will you dislike my post?


    To me these two paragraphs sum up what appears, at least for the moment, to be the reality of the chemistry involved with our team. Maybe it always has been part of the reality, who knows. The famous Ditka vs Ryan feuds and the Ditka vs McMahon feuds tend to bear that out. No matter how crazy it may have seemed we won a lot of football games in the 80s with all that going on.

    I guess you can call these coincidences until we get a larger sample size. But if it keeps working, you shrug and let Cutler keep doing his thing, even if he does look petulant or sour during games. But the larger issue here is the presumption that everybody on a team has to hold hands and sing "Kum Ba Yah" every day. That's nonsense.
    Folks who've followed the Bears really should know better. (Truer words were never spoken and I've been following them for over 40 years)

    Ditka was ready to meet Ryan out behind the Orange Bowl to duke it out. At least one Pro Bowler I know of on that team couldn't stand Jim McMahon. It didn't matter. It never does if you win. Chemistry is such a mysterious thing. Maybe Webb plays better if he's annoyed with Cutler. Maybe Cutler has a better feel for play calling than Tice, and had every right to be impatient. Maybe Cutler is the excitable ying to Lovie Smith's flat-line yang.(We can use a little excitement and fire on game days coming from somewhere because it sure isn't gonna come from Lovie who must take a few hits of NYQUIL before every game)

    This is where I put on my jackie jokeman hat and say, "This is the f'n Chicago Bears we're talking about not the New England Patriots. You all want to follow a team with no apparent friction and the personality of a bowl of coleslaw then enjoy some sex and travel and take a fvcking hike to Boston!"

    Over the years the Bears have thrived on internal friction and a little chaos coupled with just a touch of the bizarre. Hell Halas was always known for stirring it up whenever it didn't exist which is just one reason why he brought in Ditka as the HC yet told him that Buddy Ryan would remain his DC. Does anybody think that craft old bastard wasn't aware that he was putting kerosene can next to an open fire? That battle got them both fired up enough to get their own offense and defense competing with one another every day in practice until they got so good playing against one another nobody could beat them.

    In 1985 the Bears had the #1 Defense in the NFL and the #1 Offense in points score and all of that came about in an environment where Ditka and Ryan would rather piss on one anothers shoes than talk with one another. After the SB win the offense carried Ditka off the field and the defense carried Buddy off. Mac would come off the field with Ditka so mad that he'd changed a play he'd just sent in that he was ready to beat the crap out of him right there and all Mac would do is just shout back and say, "Fuck You". You guys think this is the first time we had a winning QB who didn't always play "nicey nice" and told his coach to "Go Fuck Himself"? We won a SB with that guy and the bunch of lunatics he lead so get into some reality for awhile. That Cutler/Webb incidence and his thing with Tice are like Sunday School class compared to those 80s Bears teams.

    So we've got a QB who has to wear the "runs with scissors" sticker instead of the "plays well with others". So what? As long as we win games and championships that just fine with me and it would probably behoove all of us to get used to it and pay attention to that rather than Cutler's latest bout of so called misbehavior. It's not likely to change so stop letting the media tell you what you should think. Use your own eyes and your own brains and stop being sheep.

    You keep that up and the rest of us will make you become Packer fans.

    Last edited by soulman; 10-05-2012 at 07:56 PM.
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    Certified Oline Zealot JustAnotherBearsFan99's Avatar
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Gift received at 04-16-2013, 02:27 PM from weneedmorelinemen
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    I've never disliked a post before so you're safe, Soul .

    I just want us to win. I've always admired winners who are also class acts. Walter Payton was viewed this way. He was far from perfect, but I always felt like he represented the Chicago Bears in a classy way.

    I'm OK with Cutler being Cutler. As long as he wins.
    Trestman - Kromer - Tucker - DeCamillis

    I'm looking forward to seeing these guys coach. Hope they're good.


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