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Thread: Some Bears great, but not Hall of Fame worthy

  1. #1
    Senior Member short faced bear's Avatar
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    Some Bears great, but not Hall of Fame worthy

    The Bears need a place of distinction for long-serving players without a chance of enshrinement in Canton

    Mike Mulligan

    7:15 p.m. CDT, October 23, 2012

    Somewhere between Brian Urlacher pushing Charles Tillman for Defensive Player of the Year and Jon Gruden hailing a group of All-Time Bears currently on the defense, the thought occurred that something important is missing from the franchise. No, not cheerleaders. But let's talk later.

    Call it a Dallas-style Ring of Honor, a team Hall of Fame like Green Bay or a combo "Ring of Fame" a la the Redskins. The Bears need a place of distinction for long-serving players without a chance of enshrinement in Canton, Ohio.

    The Pro Football Hall of Fame is at 2121 George Halas Drive NW and that is as close a connection some accomplished Bears players are ever going to get to glory. They and the fan base need a more realistic aspiration.

    From Tillman to Brandon Marshall to Jay Cutler you can argue the Bears currently field players as good as any in team history at their positions. Impressive stuff when you consider the Bears lead the NFL with 30 Hall of Fame inductees, including 27 who spent the majority of their career with the franchise. Less impressive when you note that Sid Luckman would be listed as both quarterback and cornerback on any dream team of Bears Hall of Famers. And he'd line up opposite Red Grange in the defensive backfield.

    Being the best for a franchise doesn't translate to being an all-time great. Call it Pat Mannelly syndrome.

    Mannelly is the longest serving Bears player with team records for 221 games played and 15 years of service. He's as good a long snapper as you will ever see, but there is no room for him in a Pro Bowl, let alone the Hall of Fame.

    Kicker Jan Stenerud is the only specialty player in the Hall of Fame and one of three kickers counting George Blanda, a longtime quarterback and Lou Groza, an offensive tackle.

    Punter Ray Guy can't get into the Hall of Fame. Will Morten Andersen, the all-time leading scorer in NFL history, eventually make it? Robbie Gould is the fourth most accurate kicker in NFL history and boasts the five most accurate seasons in team history and he doesn't have a chance.

    You hate to dismiss Devin Hester's chances since he's the most prolific returner in league history with a league-record 17 touchdowns, not counting another TD return of a missed field goal and a kickoff return for the fastest ever TD in a Super Bowl. But you can pretty much dismiss his chances.

    In a league where 1,696 players are available every week, there are only 267 players in the Hall of Fame. Generally speaking you have to be among the top two or three at your position for a generation to be enshrined. And you can argue that selection is unfairly weighed toward offensive players, a trend that only promises to continue in an era where the record books are being rewritten.

    A whopping 50.6 of all inductees are offensive players. That might sound balanced enough until you consider only 31.7 percent are defensive players. The rest are coaches and contributors to the game who make up 18.7 percent.

    What does that mean for the likes of Julius Peppers, Urlacher, Lance Briggs or Tillman?

    Again, you can argue that Tillman is the best cornerback in team history, but he doesn't have a shot at making the Hall of Fame. Since coming into the NFL, he is in the top 10 in every major category you would want from a cornerback. And since statistics on forced fumbles started being tracked in 1991, Tillman is one of only two players with 30 interceptions and 30 forced fumbles. The other guy is former Eagles safety Brian Dawkins, a nine-time Pro Bowl selection and six-time All Pro. Tillman has made just one Pro Bowl.

    Defensive backs are poorly represented in the Hall of Fame with only 23, including 14 cornerbacks inducted in the modern era, which is roughly 1960 to present or 52 years. Not much of a strike ratio. Hall of Fame voters may argue about what to do with Ronde Barber, another zone cornerback. They will ever be blissfully unmoved by Tillman.

    The current Bears most likely to make the Hall of Fame someday are Peppers and Urlacher, although both would be well-served with a championship to seal the deal. Peppers has 1031/2 sacks and is tied for 25th all-time in that category. The league has only been keeping track of sacks since 1982, but Peppers is a dominant player and will eventually make it. Urlacher has 411/2 sacks and 21 Interceptions, making him just one of four players in the 40/20 club.

    One Hall of Fame voter said Tuesday that Urlacher reminded him of Randy Gradishar, a seven-time Pro Bowler who was the 1978 Defensive Player of the Year for Denver's very good, but not great, Orange Crush defense. Gradishar is still waiting to make the cut Urlacher also could experience a backlash for his overrated reputation, although he too should one day get the call.

    Only 23 linebackers have made the Hall of Fame in the modern era, which is why it will be difficult for Briggs to make the cut if Urlacher does. Briggs has the longest running streak of Pro Bowl appearances by a defensive player with seven and is a Defensive Player of the Year candidate. He would be helped by a championship, a Defensive Player of the Year award or a tangible way out of Urlacher's shadow.

    Cutler is another guy who has been to just one Pro Bowl. He's as good a quarterback as many Bears fans have seen in their lifetime and already ranks in the top five in most team passing records while currently enjoying the best career passer rating in team history. But that mark is just 81.0 percent. Luckman had a 75.0 passer rating because he threw 132 interceptions. Hopefully Cutler won't touch that record.

    Marshall has made three Pro Bowls and is as good at his position as the Bears have seen. He's another guy better suited for a team Hall of Fame than the real one at this point.





    http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports...1246157.column
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  • #2
    Senior Member short faced bear's Avatar
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Gift received at 02-04-2012, 11:13 PM from Dagan81
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    Briggs needs 2-3 more pro-bowls imp but I think Mulligan is right about getting out of Brian's shadow. And I think he is, but might not be enough to make HOF.

    As I said in another thread Tillman breaks Dawkins interception/forced fumble record and his case is pretty strong. If he has Darrell Green like tenure he's rock solid. Can the HOF overlook Peanut being overlooked for pro-bowls?

    HOF is a bit fickle but I'll settle for them getting SB rings, pro-bowls and being the best damn defense in the NFL

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    Yankee Doodle Dandy Dagan81's Avatar
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    You said it, shorty. Urlacher is a sure bet to get into the Hall of Fame, but whether he will five years after he retires is another thing altogether. Peppers needs another 30-40 sacks to cement his place in Canton, though I think he's well on his way there. Peanut and Briggs are going to make a push for the Defensive Player of the Year award this season, but if Briggs earns a First-Team All Pro ranking and wins Defensive Player of the Year, you better bet your bottom dollar that he will eventually get into the Hall of Fame. Tillman should have made the Pro Bowl years before he did last season. I don't know why there haven't been more Chicago Bears mentioned throughout the annals of the NFL who were great defensive backs.

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    Senior Member ZifanQ's Avatar
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    HoF is very hard to get in if you're a ST team player. I think that there is only one Kicker in the HoF and I have my doubt if Morten Andersen aka the Great Dane will be in it. I think that he should be in it because after all a kicker is importen puls he is all time leading the NFL with most scored points.

    If Hester wants to be in HoF he should proberly make a return for a TD for the rest of his life in every game.
    Peanut got my doubts he'll be in it, he is to "unknown" for the rest of the NFL, he doesn't have the "hype".
    Briggs... I hope and think he is going to make it specially if he can keep up the play for one more season or two.
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    Senior Member short faced bear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZifanQ View Post
    HoF is very hard to get in if you're a ST team player. I think that there is only one Kicker in the HoF and I have my doubt if Morten Andersen aka the Great Dane will be in it. I think that he should be in it because after all a kicker is importen puls he is all time leading the NFL with most scored points.

    If Hester wants to be in HoF he should proberly make a return for a TD for the rest of his life in every game.
    Peanut got my doubts he'll be in it, he is to "unknown" for the rest of the NFL, he doesn't have the "hype".
    Briggs... I hope and think he is going to make it specially if he can keep up the play for one more season or two.

    If game changers mean anything to the HOF I would think Hester requires consideration.
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    Hester revolutionized the spot; Dante hall is now an afterthought. He should coast in. I'd say 5-6 more TD's will be like cement.
    I'd love to see Briggs make it, but it'd probably take a while
    Urlacher first ballot
    Peppers needs a lot of sacks, but given his size and speed, I could see that happening, and hopefully he goes in as a Bear.
    After that, none, unless Cutler brings us to a trio of SB's....
    If somehow, playing FS can extend his career, and Peanut played til about Ed Reed's age, I could see it, but like Briggs, not a first time ballot.
    Last edited by Henry Burris; 10-24-2012 at 12:18 PM.


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    Senior Member short faced bear's Avatar
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    Peanut should make the pro-bowl this year, at the pace he's on he's all-pro. If JJ-swat Watt play recedes- defensive player of the year would be within reach.
    THAT would help HOF considerably.
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    Member Shark86x's Avatar
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    I actually agree with Mulligan on this. The Bears need their own hall of fame or circle of honor or Bear's Lair or whatever. We have had a heck of a lot of great players that deserve a place of honor. We have more retired numbers and guys in the HOF than most other teams in any sport. But the guys that can't get on the HOF need recognition. Wouldn't it be great to be able to go to a Bears museum, if you will, and see photos, statues, and other memorabilia for our greats? Maybe also have a traveling display? Set it up at Soldier Field on game days, have it in Bourbonnais during training camp, up at Halas Hall the rest of the year?

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    Yankee Doodle Dandy Dagan81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shark86x View Post
    I actually agree with Mulligan on this. The Bears need their own hall of fame or circle of honor or Bear's Lair or whatever. We have had a heck of a lot of great players that deserve a place of honor. We have more retired numbers and guys in the HOF than most other teams in any sport. But the guys that can't get on the HOF need recognition. Wouldn't it be great to be able to go to a Bears museum, if you will, and see photos, statues, and other memorabilia for our greats? Maybe also have a traveling display? Set it up at Soldier Field on game days, have it in Bourbonnais during training camp, up at Halas Hall the rest of the year?
    To me, it's at least as great of an honor to get your number retired and your name place in the Ring of Honor of your former club as it is to be inducted into the Hall of Fame. Guys like Mike Singletary, Dan Hampton, Doug Atkins, Richard Dent, Joey Fortunato, Doug Buffone, Rick Casares, Stan Jones, Ed Sprenkle, and Gary Fencik deserve to be recognized in hall of fame set up by the franchise as well as have their names mentioned in a ring of honor. The Bears, for all the good things about them, are so behind the times in comparison to the rest of the league in some ways that it's not even funny.

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