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Thread: Y'All Won't Like This Idea One Bit................

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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    Y'All Won't Like This Idea One Bit................

    I figure this is guaranteed to stir up some discussion in a slow week for news.

    J'Marcus Webb Should Be the Chicago Bears' Left Tackle in 2013


    By Andrew Dannehy

    (Contributor) on February 12, 2013




    Jonathan Daniel/Getty Images



    J'Marcus Webb might be the player Chicago Bears fans love to hate the most, but he should be back as the team's starting left tackle when they open the 2013-14 season.


    There is no doubt the Bears offensive line needs to improve and Webb was a part of the problem. Still, he's not as bad as many Bears fans think and has the potential to be very good.


    While being the whipping boy for many fans and even his quarterback, Webb was quietly the Bears' best offensive lineman in 2012. He finished with a Pro Football Focus rating of -0.7; not good, but much better than anyone else. The next closest lineman was Lance Louis, who rated at -1.8 in significantly fewer snaps, largely because he couldn't run-block.


    While being the best lineman on the Bears is kind of like being the tallest dwarf, Webb wasn't terrible compared to the rest of the league. He ranked 35th amongst all tackles in Pass Blocking Efficiency on PFF; not good, but not awful.


    Many fans have clamored for new offensive coordinator Aaron Kromer to be reunited with New Orleans free-agent left tackle Jermon Bushrod, but that could be a downgrade for the Bears. Bushrod ranked 45th on PFF and gave up one hurry every 15.7 snaps, compared to Webb's rate of one every 20.5. Even in his best season—2011—Bushrod gave up a hurry every 21.4 snaps—and that was with better linemen around him, allowing the Saints to give him more help. (Not good huh? Yet the guy made two Pro Bowls? So WTFIUWT?)


    Bushrod is a better run-blocker—thus earned a slightly better overall grade from PFF—but Webb also has a much higher upside, being four years younger. If Bushrod is an upgrade, it would be slight and not worth the salary cap room that could be spent on other upgrades. (Hmmmm! )


    Price is an important factor to keep in mind. There are some premium left tackles available in Ryan Clady and Branden Albert, but they would use up most of the Bears' salary cap space. Considering left tackle is already their best position on the line, it doesn't seem wise to spend most of their money for that specific spot. (I see his point but I don't agree with it)


    The Bears could likely get a good right tackle and a starting guard for less money than it would take to sign a left tackle. If they can solidify the right tackle spot, they would be able to help Webb out more with extra blockers if they needed to. That is something they couldn't do much of a year ago due to the gaping hole on the right side. (So he wants to give up on Carimi already after just one year but keep starting Webb who's still struggles after three? )


    The other avenue in which the Bears could improve the position is the draft. If a player falls to them and is the best on the board, they shouldn't hesitate to take him; however, it doesn't seem likely. There aren't many rookies who can step in and solidify the left tackle spot right away. (True dat)


    Many people have forgotten Webb's background and the fact that he still was always viewed as a project. There's plenty of time for him to reach his potential. Although he just finished his third season, Webb is just 24 years old, only a year older than Minnesota's Matt Kalil, who just finished his rookie season. (But we need better NOW!)


    While Kalil made a seamless transition to the NFL, he did so from a major university—USC—where he saw top defensive players in nearly every game and every day in practice. Webb is from West Texas A&M, was drafted in the seventh round, was expected to be a project with potential and has proved to be exactly that. The Bears coaches put him in a bad situation by throwing him into the fire as a rookie. (Yeah how 'bout that but what we need is someone with LT talent and capability now not potential. How long does this potential last anyway, until he's thirty?)


    While right tackle Gabe Carimi struggled physically, Webb's struggles have been mostly mental. He has a massive frame and moves incredibly well for his size. From a physical standpoint, he has almost everything anyone could want in a left tackle; it's just a matter of tapping into that potential. (Which is why that previous idea about finding a RT as opposed to a LT makes no sense. Carimi can and will get healthier but you can't fix stupid, immature and mentally incompetent as easy)


    What has gone mostly unnoticed is Webb's improvement, which has been both consistent and dramatic since he entered the league. As a rookie right tackle in 2010, Webb's gave up a hurry nearly every 11 snaps to go with 11 sacks and 11 penalties, according to PFF. Last season, he gave up a hurry every 19 snaps, to go with 12 sacks and 14 penalties. However, this past season his sack total dropped to seven and he committed eight penalties. (I agree. These are stats that can't be denied)

    If he continues to improve at this rate, he isn't just going to be a serviceable left tackle—he's going to be a very good one. (But this I can or at least question in the strongest possible terms.)


    One of the most interesting parts of the Bears' 2013 season will be to see how a change in offensive line coaches will impact them. Former line coach and coordinator Mike Tice came in with a good reputation, but couldn't get his line ranked higher than 30th on PFF in any of his three seasons. Since Kromer took over the Saints line in 2009, they have not ranked lower than 17th. (Hooray help is on the way )


    Some of his former Saints players spoke glowingly about their former coach, who has turned late picks and undrafted players into Pro Bowl-caliber performers. He's succeeded with multiple tackles, guards and centers. If Kromer can get the most out of Webb, the Bears won't need a new left tackle. There aren't many in the league who are more talented. (That's a big if when we're talking about the Terror of Taco Tuesday but yeah as OL coaches go they don't come much better.)


    Webb won't turn 25 until the Bears start camp next season. As he has continued to grow and mature as a man, he has improved as a player. If that growth continues, the Bears already have the cornerstone of their line.

    While it's hard to be patient at such an important position, there is plenty of reason to believe their patience will ultimately pay off. (Sorry but I haven't seen this maturity as adverstised and so far all he's really shown the potential to be by the 2014 season is 26. We've also run out of time to be patient. That was three years ago where ya' been?)
    I'm getting to that age where a lifetime warranty just doesn't mean as much to me anymore as an afternoon nap.



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    Mello Jello soulman's Avatar
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    I don't know where he got his stats on Bushrod but how is it that the kid made it to a Pro Bowl and he still contends that Webb is more than his equal as a pass blocker? Something doesn't seem quite right there but if anyone has a line on whether Bushrod is a better option at LT than Webb it's gotta be Kromer. He's been coaching him for four years.

    I dunno maybe Kromer says give me one more year with this kid Webb to see if I can turn him into a quality starting LT and maybe Emery gives him that because the cap budget is tight and he has many of our own FAs to re-sign. Right now the coaching staff is still doing their player evaluations so that's probably why we haven't heard much or seen any action as far as re-signings or releases go.

    I still believe Webb is salvageable as a RT or a Swing OT but as 2013 starter at LT, no I wouldn't be happy with that at all. In any event Webb needs to be pushed so we need someone with LT skills even if it's not a top FA or if we can get a top FA LT then we move him to RT and let Carimi and Webb push each other. From my perspective as long as Webb feels he has that job sewed up he won't improve far enough or fast enough to get the job done.
    I'm getting to that age where a lifetime warranty just doesn't mean as much to me anymore as an afternoon nap.



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  • #3
    Junior Member inchibearfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by soulman View Post
    Many fans have clamored for new offensive coordinator Aaron Kromer to be reunited with New Orleans free-agent left tackle Jermon Bushrod, but that could be a downgrade for the Bears. Bushrod ranked 45th on PFF and gave up one hurry every 15.7 snaps, compared to Webb's rate of one every 20.5. Even in his best season—2011—Bushrod gave up a hurry every 21.4 snaps—and that was with better linemen around him, allowing the Saints to give him more help. (Not good huh? Yet the guy made two Pro Bowls? So WTFIUWT?
    Was Bushrod given TE help as much as Webb or was Bushrod expected to hold his own? I know that Webb was not expected to hold his own and couldn't even do it with TE help sometimes.

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    Certified Oline Zealot JustAnotherBearsFan99's Avatar
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Gift received at 04-16-2013, 02:27 PM from weneedmorelinemen
Message: Here you go, buddy.  Wear it with pride.GameballBears Head LogoGeorge Halas
    I'm just waiting to see how the new staff evaluates all the players, and Webb in particular. None of us are objective regarding Webb at this point. We all have our biases due to the fact he's been a 3 year "project" who's had a painful learning curve.

    Fans often like to label a project player as a bust and can't ever bring themselves to admit that young players often do improve. Webb may or may not be one of these. But we have a 3 year investment in this player, so it's worth waiting a few months to see what Trestman's crew thinks of him.

    He has improved.

    We had far more problems with Carimi and our interior linemen this past season than we did with Webb. And Webb didn't always have help. Often he did, but not as much as people like to believe. I still have the games taped from last season, and watch them multiple times, focusing on the oline and Webb. Reality is that he was our 2nd best offensive lineman, behind RG Lance Louis.

    As good as it may feel to hate Webb, it may not be best for the team to write him completely off. Soul has mentioned in a number of posts that he MAY be a good swing tackle for us. I agree this could be the case. If it is, then the guy has value to the Chicago Bears.

    If Trestman's crew feels he's worth keeping (backup or starter) then I'm fine with that. If they feel he's no good, then cut him - I'm fine with that too.

    But it's foolish on our part to not want EVERY player on this roster to get a fresh evaluation from the new regime in Chicago. Let them sort through the players and evaluate guys like Webb (Urlacher too). We may be pleasantly surprised & find we do have some salvageable players, who we thought were done.

    Just my 2-cents.
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    Senior Member Riczaj01's Avatar
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Gift received at 09-21-2012, 11:42 PM from soulman
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    Inchi, I agree NO's uses there TE's in passroutes, as well as their RB's, Bushrod is left on much more of an isleland then Webb ever was; and when Webb was left on an isleland he was brutally bad.

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    I'm On Edge!! matsellah's Avatar
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    It was like with Rex: Million Dollar Arm... 10 cent head. You can have all the talent in the world, but you can't fix stupid. So unless Webb comes out of TC explaining how Clausewitz' combat philosophy can be used to counter defensive blitz schemes supported by applied differential equation theory, he'll still suck.

    But y'know... nobody threw a prettier deep ball than The Sex Dragon.
    __

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    Certified Oline Zealot JustAnotherBearsFan99's Avatar
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Gift received at 04-16-2013, 02:27 PM from weneedmorelinemen
Message: Here you go, buddy.  Wear it with pride.GameballBears Head LogoGeorge Halas
    I'm not defending Webb, but he DID perform well on an island during the season, more often than we want to admit. If you watch the games (if by chance you have a way to re-watch them) then take an objective look at Webb's play when he did not have help. Sometimes he struggled. But often he did a decent job. Carimi on the other hand was our worst olineman. People blew past him early and often.

    Let the new coaches go over the roster. Let them take a fresh look at everyone. Hey, maybe we have a lot of bums who need cutting, including Webb. Maybe they'll feel like some of our older players are done too, like Urlacher.

    But I'm really hoping, for the team's sake, that some of these guys will grade out as worth keeping to help the team, even if they are simply solid backups.
    Last edited by JustAnotherBearsFan99; 02-12-2013 at 11:09 AM.
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    Certified Oline Zealot JustAnotherBearsFan99's Avatar
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Gift received at 04-16-2013, 02:27 PM from weneedmorelinemen
Message: Here you go, buddy.  Wear it with pride.GameballBears Head LogoGeorge Halas
    This isn't just a "Webb thing" but a pet peave I have with fans. We tend to be overly emotional regarding players (both good and bad) and fail to be objective. We back a guy, or hate a guy, based on emotion, rather than facts and logic. We fail to accept the fact that sometimes young players who start out bad, can improve and end up being good players.

    I'm not talking about Webb here. I'm talking about players in general. We need to have an open mind, especially with a new coaching staff, that looks very promising at developing talent.

    We have a TON of things to fix on the Chicago Bears this off-season. There are question marks on offense and defense. I'm hoping these new coaches can work with some of our question mark players and we can maximize our draft resources and FA money to do the most good. I'm hoping this anyway.
    Last edited by JustAnotherBearsFan99; 02-12-2013 at 08:54 AM.
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    Senior Member Grizzblue's Avatar
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    Not that he should be handed the job but garza and *insert lg here** are a much bigger issue than Webb

    We NEED to draft/sign a c and g above all and that will make a huge difference

    Then if we can get competition in with Webb that's gravy but replacing Webb and leaving garza and spencer will leave us just a bad if not worse than we are now

    He needs competition, yes but if you watch his run blocking its actually damn good.

    If kromer can get him over the hump great if not we need a backup plan

    Besides contract years seem to be a grow up or get out for most players in his position

    He has potential, but seems to be holding himself back, maybe his security blanket being gone and him looking at a payday if he grows up may help him tap it

    But for gods sake make him win a real camp battle...

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    Member Shark86x's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustAnotherBearsFan99 View Post
    This isn't just a "Webb thing" but a pet peave I have with fans. We tend to be overly emotional regarding players (both good and bad) and fail to be objective. We back a guy, or hate a guy, based on emotion, rather than facts and logic. We fail to accept the fact that sometimes young players who start out bad, can improve and end up being good players.

    I'm not talking about Webb here. I'm talking about players in general. We need to have an open mind, especially with a new coaching staff, that looks very promising at developing talent.

    We have a TON of things to fix on the Chicago Bears this off-season. There are question marks on offense and defense. I'm hoping these new coaches can work with some of our question mark players and we can maximize our draft resources and FA money to do the most good. I'm hoping this anyway.
    But we are fans. That means we ARE emotional with our team. We lose, I have to face a pecker fan at work - and then that's a second miserable day from one loss. So yes, I get emotional and blame certain players who consistently play poorly, and continue to back good players who occasionally screw up. Emotions are a luxury I have as a fan when it comes to player evaluation.

    Coaches, managers and owners have to have the emotions of Mr. Spock, not me. I think Emery and Trestman are the perfect guys for this team. They are your typical pencil-necked geeks who love numbers and stats and are so busy with them and they are so new to the team and the players that they have absolutely no emotional ties to anyone.

    Oh, and Webb SUCKS! Just maybe not so much as he used to, and certainly not as much as some of the other guys we've had over the years. ;-)

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