Bears Offense: The Good, the Bad, the Ugly

Discussion in 'Chicago Bears' started by The Benjamin, Oct 28, 2013.

  1. A-11

    A-11 Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2013
    Messages:
    219
    Likes Received:
    70
    Ratings:
    +74 / 1 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    Ricza, I am not saying don't run up the middle, lol. I'm just saying Trestman runs it up Gaza's backside more then I'd expect because Forte does do better outside. I think any run can be used to wear down the D, and you do have to trust that eventually one down the gut is going to break the line...

    I'm just not sure why the ratio inside to outside the tackles isn't more balanced. Also, if you want to "soften up the middle" I'd think you'd use bush on more series. Not to tip off your plays by personnel but to mix it up and keep Forte fresher.
    • Like Like x 1
  2. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2006
    Messages:
    22,196
    Likes Received:
    2,774
    Ratings:
    +3,331 / 9 / -8
    ßearz ßuckz:
    1,506ß
    While I would like to see our 8mil backup actually being used, if the RB position is going to get less then 20 touches all of those, or at least the vast majority, should go to the primary rb.
  3. BradMustersGhost

    BradMustersGhost Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2013
    Messages:
    708
    Likes Received:
    294
    Ratings:
    +353 / 1 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    307ß
    Two thoughts: 1-our ppg is obviously aided by the turnovers/defensive td's scored by our D.
    2-the low 3rd down conv. rate is the UGLIEST stat which you cited
    3-anyone who has seen this offense, realizes that the BIGGEST PROBLEM with the offense is its INCONSISTENCY. It just doesn't quite pass the vaunted eyeball test. Good to great offenses don't look like pure s*** for 2+ quarters EVERY game before they "wake up."
  4. Henry Burris

    Henry Burris Head Coach

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    19,578
    Likes Received:
    2,316
    Ratings:
    +2,542 / 8 / -10
    ßearz ßuckz:
    545ß
    Ya wanna know something even uglier? We've run the 2nd fewest offensive plays in the league. That goes hand in hand with having the 2nd most 3 and outs. There's no way in hell the 2012 Bears defense could've held up this long. It's nice we've finally got an offensive line, and 2 really good WR's and a good TE, but, weren't those the "missing ingredients" that Jay needed to perform well? I'm not taking away the fact that this is a brand new offense, and playcalling has to be curtailed to the limits of the rookies, but there have been too many pass plays, whether it's Cutler or Trestman's fault, and as a result, we get to watch our defense's corpse dragged up and down the field.

    Just to avoid any confusion for anyone: Yes, this defense is garbage, yes, this offense is going to take time to grow, but again:

    31st in offensive plays
    5th in offensive turnovers
    31st in 3rd down conversion rates

    There's no hope for the defense this year, but, I wouldn't be all that surprised if those three stats go up with a return to the run game.
    • Like Like x 2
  5. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2006
    Messages:
    22,196
    Likes Received:
    2,774
    Ratings:
    +3,331 / 9 / -8
    ßearz ßuckz:
    1,506ß
    hey Hey HEY!!! The O is not the problem!

    It doesn't matter they cannot stay on the field or get 3rd down conversions and are turning the ball over the ball at a higher click then just about every other team...they are NOT the problem! It's all the d's fault...you leave this Chicago O alone....it's been so long since we've had a good O, and not had to watch Cutler get *sob* being beaten around every *sob* time*sob*he*sob* drops back*sob* It's all the D's faaaauuuulllllt.
    • Like Like x 1
  6. Henry Burris

    Henry Burris Head Coach

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    19,578
    Likes Received:
    2,316
    Ratings:
    +2,542 / 8 / -10
    ßearz ßuckz:
    545ß
    Exactly. I honestly don't expect much of the offense in the upcoming weeks without Jay, but if there's more of a balance on our offense (we're passing 60% of the time, and while we have the 4th highest ppc, the fact that we have so few plays run, and have those 3 and outs shows our passing game is wildly inconsistent), and the running game starts to look better, I would be at least 50/50 on drafting a QB as early as possible next year.
    • Like Like x 1
  7. MPbears68

    MPbears68 Pro-Bowler

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2011
    Messages:
    4,338
    Likes Received:
    1,123
    Ratings:
    +1,376 / 2 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    400ß
    The O is scoring much better than in recent years but definitely needs to improve on ball control and ball security, no doubt.

    Let me know fellas when the defense plans on stopping anybody. Still waiting....
  8. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2006
    Messages:
    22,196
    Likes Received:
    2,774
    Ratings:
    +3,331 / 9 / -8
    ßearz ßuckz:
    1,506ß
    Next year when they have talent....until then the O has to protect them, but the D is doing their part in allowing a sputtering O to score by giving them plenty of chances(via turn overs).
  9. MPbears68

    MPbears68 Pro-Bowler

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2011
    Messages:
    4,338
    Likes Received:
    1,123
    Ratings:
    +1,376 / 2 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    400ß
    Problem is, when turnovers don't come in bunches (and they won't against Rodgers for instance), the defense STILL MUST GET SOME STOPS. And this unit has proved itself utterly incapable of stopping drives unless the opposing QB makes mistakes. Takeaways are great but they can't be the only way the D can get off the field.
  10. Henry Burris

    Henry Burris Head Coach

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    19,578
    Likes Received:
    2,316
    Ratings:
    +2,542 / 8 / -10
    ßearz ßuckz:
    545ß
    Honestly, this team never should have lost the Detroit game, and the Saints game was certainly within reach at times. I'm not damning the offense, or anything, but we need to drop the hype on them, and see what's really going wrong. It's all pure conjecture right now, because the following reasons could be why the offense sputters so much:
    1. Trestman knows our running game is kind of weak, and is trying to get things going with the pass game
    2. Trestman is, at least so far, worse than Tice with balancing his playcalling (there was a 5 attempt difference with Tice, whereas, again, 60% of our plays are passes)
    3. Jay is audibleing out of too many pass plays. This will definitively be put to rest these next few weeks, one way or another.
    4. Our offensive line has weaknesses, preventing them from blocking well, in the run game. It bears mentioning that, to go with #2, the run calls aren't exactly creative.
    5. They play in "catch up" mode too early in games, deciding to go for the deeper passes, and turning the ball over to the opposing defense, who makes their subsequent drive even harder, because they are likely to put 3-7 on the board.
    I'm sure it's a combination of the above, and as much as I want to see them win, it would reflect negatively on Cutler if this offense is able to at least sustain drives, and still score multiple times.

    The good news, though, is that we're currently 5th in Red Zone TD%, so hopefully that's a trend that continues. Josh McCown played wonderfully last week in the red zone, so there's another positive.
  11. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2006
    Messages:
    22,196
    Likes Received:
    2,774
    Ratings:
    +3,331 / 9 / -8
    ßearz ßuckz:
    1,506ß
    No doubt, it's why I wanted lovie and Rod gone, I don't care for the TO or TD approach to D that had become common w/the Bears. You are seeing it in Dallas now w/Hot Rod, they are dead last against the pass.

    Problem w/the D getting SOME stops, is they are so bad and hurt it won't happen, so the Bears O HAS to eat ToP, which is going to be even more difficult b/c McCown is the QB.
  12. MPbears68

    MPbears68 Pro-Bowler

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2011
    Messages:
    4,338
    Likes Received:
    1,123
    Ratings:
    +1,376 / 2 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    400ß
    My guess is that #s 3 & 4 are the biggest factors. The OL definitely seems better at pass pro than run blocking (role reversal from two years ago) and Cutler does seem to be deviating from the game plan too much at the line. I'd put an honorable mention on un-imaginative run play calling from Trestman. Outside of those Jeffery end abounds which he loves so much, the rush plays seem generally pretty mundane.

    There's been a couple games this year in which the Bears opening drive was a thing of beauty and moved the ball downfield nicely with a mix of runs and short, safe passes. Even when they've scored and took the early lead, it looks like they abandon that strategy immediately afterwards. Is that the HC? Or is it Jay?

    Yes, the Detroit game was a "should win" that was thrown away by a combination of terrible defense and Jay turning the ball over 3 times with 2 of those going for immediate Detroit TDs. I can forgive the NO loss, though it was winnable, as simply getting beat by one of the best teams in the NFL. The Redskins loss however was an unconscionable farce entirely on the defense.
  13. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2006
    Messages:
    22,196
    Likes Received:
    2,774
    Ratings:
    +3,331 / 9 / -8
    ßearz ßuckz:
    1,506ß
    So the O going 3 and out, 5 plays and 18 yards for a FG, 2 plays TD b/c of the Bears D turning the ball over, 1 play int, 3 plays punt, 3 plays punt in the 1st half had nothing to do w/the Bears losing?

    Gould missing a gimmie FG had nothing to do w/the Bears losing?

    Did you know that Washington punted more then the Bears did, and the Bears had more possessions, but the D was a complete fail? Bears had 1 more drive(not including that 27sec halftime walkoff), 1 less punt, the same amount of TO's, but couldn't get more points.

    I disagree. I think the O in the first half, until McCown came in, was sputtering badly, outside of 1 TD cuased b/c of the Bears D they did nothing, and again this is not a D that can hold off a team if you keep giving them the ball back.
    • Like Like x 1
  14. MPbears68

    MPbears68 Pro-Bowler

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2011
    Messages:
    4,338
    Likes Received:
    1,123
    Ratings:
    +1,376 / 2 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    400ß
    Ric, no one is denying the offense's sputters and missed opportunities.

    But when you give up 38 defensive points and 499 yards to a team no one confuses with the greatest show on turf, pinning the loss (while scoring 41!) on Jay Cutler and Robbie Gould falls kind of flat.

    It's also an exercise in mental gymnastics to say "the D can't stop anyone so I blame losses on the O for not holding the ball 40 minutes a game".
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. The Benjamin

    The Benjamin George Halas Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    Messages:
    46,838
    Likes Received:
    1,816
    Ratings:
    +2,066 / 7 / -8
    ßearz ßuckz:
    1,316ß
    Also that missed FG was not the difference. Had we lost by 2 or 3 points okay.
  16. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2006
    Messages:
    22,196
    Likes Received:
    2,774
    Ratings:
    +3,331 / 9 / -8
    ßearz ßuckz:
    1,506ß
    No one is saying the D doesn't suck, merely that looking at the points the O is scoring isn't telling the true story. The O sputtering is exagerating the D problems.

    When you say the O isn't the problem, it's all on the D, you are ignoring the real problem. The problem is that the D sucks, and there is no fixing it. There is no scheme that calls for zero pass rush from the front four and Safeties that cannot cover. None, zero, zilch, it doesn't exist. There is no scheme that Tucker, Lovie, Hot Rod, or anyone else could run to create pressure from Inj'd/Old Peppers, Wootton at DT, Paea(not asked to get qb pressures) and Shea(bust). There is no scheme that Tucker, Lovie, Hot Rod or anyone else can call that will protect Conte and Wrong from sucking w/out qb pressure from the front 4. They could blitz the LB's and CB's but all that does is further expose those two giant P'sOS that are the Bears safeties.

    There is only ONE way for the Bears to win games and keep the other O from scoring, and that's to not let the opposing O on the field; the only way to do THAT is to NOT have the O sputter! It cannot start of slow or fizzle midway through. And the O hasn't proven it can do that.

    This is not Lovie's team anymore, the D is not dominant, it's not good, it's bad, it's old, worn out and bad but this wasn't the offseason to fix it, this was the offseason to know if Cutler was capable of getting the job done so the team let the D go into the tank, and no BU out there isn't helping things b/c he cannot make plays anymore, and he sure to hell couldn't stay healthy. And no Izzy isn't helping this any, no way is he taking Back up to the backup behind Wootton(who outplayed him last year) and Shea(last years 1st round pick that needed to be on the field). And it's not like Izzy's can even find the field anyways.

    The only thing Henry and I are talking about is what it takes for the team to win in the future, and far to many seem stuck on the past losses and looking at false positives about the O declaring they are not an issue. But in the future, if they continue to sputter and fail then they will be the issue b/c the D cannot be trusted, not for a single stop, and therefore the O has to up it's game, much like what the D did when Rookie Orton took the field and they won 9 games, w/all but the bare minimum of help.
    • Like Like x 3
  17. JustAnotherBearsFan99

    JustAnotherBearsFan99 Coordinator SuperFan DBS Writer

    Joined:
    May 21, 2012
    Messages:
    9,489
    Likes Received:
    2,358
    Ratings:
    +2,714 / 3 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    1,238ß
    This Monday night in particular, keeping Aaron Rodgers off the field as long as possible HAS to help our team. The offense can be our best defense here. First of all, don't fall behind early & have 3-and-outs. Obviously, if the Bears can put together long touchdown drives (not field goals but touchdowns) that eat up a ton of clock time, it helps our defense. If, on the other hand, the defense is on the field all night, then the Packers will easily put 50 or 60 points on the board. It will be a public embarrassment in front of a national audience. I hate it when we play like crap in these big night games with the entire NFL fanbase watching. And then we fans wonder why the Chicago Bears "get no respect" by the national sports media. If we want respect, we have to earn it.

    I blame Jerry Angelo.... :-)
    • Like Like x 1
  18. shark86x

    shark86x Pro-Bowler SuperFan

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2012
    Messages:
    1,583
    Likes Received:
    594
    Ratings:
    +706 / 0 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    321ß
    I think it's all of the above, but mostly a combination of 3 and 4. We saw a much more equal set of run/pass plays when McCown took over. I don't think T-man changed the playcalling, as he has said many times that Josh can handle the complete playbook. We all know the O-line, although infinitely better than last year, is a work in progress, and they are not very good at run blocking. We need to run up the middle to keep the D honest, but until we get better, we should concentrate on the outside when we need yards. Also, I still think T-man is not using the entire playbook. He is slowly working into it as the offense learns and adapts, so I think the creativity is coming, it's just not ready for prime time yet.

    As a result, our D isn't doodly squat and our O is taking a Missouri boat ride. Get ready Bears fans, when we play the peckers monday night hell will be coming for dinner. The only question I have is will the bears pull their pistols or whistle dixie?

    (The Good the Bad and the Ugly is one of the all-time great movies, but I also like The Outlaw Josey Wales.)
    • Like Like x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  19. MPbears68

    MPbears68 Pro-Bowler

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2011
    Messages:
    4,338
    Likes Received:
    1,123
    Ratings:
    +1,376 / 2 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    400ß
    Of course. Easier said than done. The Packers D is way way better than I would have guessed and their running game is too. They're no longer just Aaron Rodgers beating you with his arm and cadre of receivers.

    I've been really surprised--amazed actually--at how well GB's OL and Defense has held up despite injuries to Matthews and at OT. Their depth players and coaching have been damn good (ah-hem, contrast that with Chicago) in stepping up. I think GB's run D is in the NFL's top 5 IIRC. Combine that with our OL not yet being all that great in run blocking and I could see running the ball being a well intentioned failure. Lets be honest, it's going to take a near miracle to win so don't get your hopes up. McCown will have to play flawlessly, Rodgers will have to make a mistake or two, the D will have to play better than it has all year, and Forte will have to have a big night.

    Expecting the O to control the clock all game (to "protect the D") sounds great but is asking an awful lot. As in, a bridge too far since GB's defense is no longer a joke. I doubt we can do better than win TOP by a small margin since AR rarely turns the ball over. The Bears defense needs to man up and stop the excuses. Contain Nelson (duhhhh, ya think Rodgers might be going there?), don't let Lacy run for 140 (another duhhh!), and yeah take some chances on blitzing the QB. I'm sure it will be another EPIC FAIL by our defense but that is the only shot you have.
  20. BradMustersGhost

    BradMustersGhost Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2013
    Messages:
    708
    Likes Received:
    294
    Ratings:
    +353 / 1 / -0
    ßearz ßuckz:
    307ß
    just face it guys, we stink. :(

Share This Page