Camp Weds notes

Discussion in 'Chicago Bears' started by riczaj01, Jul 31, 2013.

  1. soulman

    soulman Pro-Bowler SuperFan DBS Writer

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    Well I'm certainly glad of that since most everyone else seemed to "get it" but unfortunately you only think you got it as your next few sentence indicate. Whether we're talking about QBs or any other position the actual level of talent of NFL starters varies greatly, wouldn't you agree? If it didn't then why would there be any need for publications to rank them accordingly?

    Ric, this is getting old. Your dogmatic viewpoint on this never changes no matter how many facts to the contrary are given to you or how they're presented. You still have the "don't confuse me with facts, my minds made up" attitude about it all so it's useless for me or anyone else to even waste our time debating it with you.

    So enjoy the view Ric but from wherever you choose to look at it the decision of who plays if Cutler goes down still comes down to McCown or Blanchard because those two are the only bullets in Trestman's gun.

    Cheers.
  2. weneedmorelinemen

    weneedmorelinemen Veteran

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    Only reason I asked was because they will have McCown as the #2. That's because it's the right football move. Blanchard is a lottery ticket that is unscratched. It is poor strategy of a team to have a kid that never played as their #2 if you don't know the player. I don't think Emery and Trestman are stupid for playing this conservative instead of rolling the dice on an untested player.

    Manning's backup last year was Caleb Hanie. He lost every game he played for us, but he had starting experience and several years in the NFL. He was their second string in front of Brock Osweiler, who was a rookie 2nd round pick in 2012. Again, experience over rookie potential. But they put in Brock during the season to get him experience and tape so they could make the decision to cut Hanie in March of 2013.

    Mallett was the third string QB behind Brian Hoyer his rookie year and inactive for most of the season. After one year, New England made him their backup QB. And again, Mallett was highly touted in the draft but fell to the third round. Not a UDFA we scraped off the street.

    Look, if Trestman was our coach last year, and got to know what Blanchard was capable of, then maybe he could be fighting for the #2 spot. As it is, Trestman has nothing to go off of to know if he can play at the level of a regular season game. He's get no game tape except for what he'll get in preseason against scrubs. I'm not saying Blanchard can't be a #2 for us. I'm just saying he can't be the #2 right now.
  3. blinddeafmute

    blinddeafmute DaBears Ditka

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    Here are the facts, Jack. Lets see who's being dogmatic in lieu of the facts.

    List of the NFL teams that made the playoffs last year, and their current NFL qb rosters.

    Texans - Schaub, Yates - vet qb, young backup
    Bengals - Dalton, Johnson - young qb, vet backup
    Packers - Rodgers, Harrell - vet qb, young backup
    Vikings - Ponder, Cassel - vet qb, vet backup
    Ravens - Flacco, Taylor - vet qb, young backup
    Colts - Luck, Hasselbeck - young qb, vet backup
    Seahawks - Wilson, Jackson - young qb, vet backup
    Redskins - Griffin III, Cousins, Grossman - young qb, young backup, vet third
    Broncos - Manning, Osweiler - Vet qb, young backup
    49ers - Kaepernick, McCoy - young qb, vet backup
    Falcons - Ryan, Davis - vet qb, young backup
    Patriots - Brady, Mallett, Tebow - Vet qb, young backup, tim tebow.


    Show me on there where anyone other than the Vikings have a veteran QB backing up a veteran QB. Most of the backups to veterans are either rookies that have never played a game in the NFL, or second year QB whom have also never played a game in the NFL...
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  4. weneedmorelinemen

    weneedmorelinemen Veteran

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    We aren't arguing youth. We are arguing Blanchard never playing a game therefore he should not be the #2 for us.

    For example, Yates was the Texans third stringer until Matt Leinart entered a game for Matt Schaub being hurt, and immediately hurt his shoulder two plays later, forcing Yates to play as a rookie. He played great, and now he is the Texans #2. But the Texans had a veteran QB as their #2 until he got hurt.

    EDIT: Not Matt Schaub. Matt Leinart. Stupid two Matts on the same team. I have corrected my mistake.

    Go over your list again and apply those rules of ever playing a regular season game. You'll find you have vets backing up vets in every case.
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2013
  5. blinddeafmute

    blinddeafmute DaBears Ditka

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    And I (and I believe Ric also) agree that Blanchard might not be the right person for the #2 job. In fact, the coaches obviously agree with that right now.

    Obviously the winning strategy is to have a vet qb backing up a young qb to mentor him. If you have a proven vet qb as your starter, then you find a young qb to groom underneath him. If Blanchard isn't that guy, then they should draft a guy next year to groom behind cutler, unless cutler bombs and they decide to replace him, etc.
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  6. weneedmorelinemen

    weneedmorelinemen Veteran

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    No, he and MP68 stated in this thread that they hope Blanchard is made the #2, and that we only go with two QBs on the roster.

    We are not worried about mentoring a young QB at this moment except for Cutler. Everyone else is here to support that mission until we know if he's going to stay on the team long term.
  7. blinddeafmute

    blinddeafmute DaBears Ditka

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    And I also hope that Blanchard is made the #2 and that McCown gets cut. Only because I hope that Blancard is a diamond in the rough and steps up to be the #2. Only the coaches can decide if that is possible, but if it is, it works out better for the team in the long run. That way we can re-sign Cutler next year and don't have to worry about using a draft pick on a backup qb.

    None of us are hoping that in lieu of any circumstances. Blanchard might not be the guy.... who knows. Hopefully he is, and if so, I hope the coaches discover that this year (maybe give him some reps at #2 during the game tonight to find out, etc.). It's not like McCown won't be available to pick up again mid season if he is needed.
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  8. weneedmorelinemen

    weneedmorelinemen Veteran

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    How the heck can the coaches know if Blanchard is capable of playing a regular season game if he has never played one or even been on a 53 man roster, and they don't know him because they just got here this year? There isn't enough info to base a judgement like that.

    Here, let's look at Graham Harrall from a earlier example. He'd been with the Green Bay organization on their practice squad for two years before they made the decision to make him their #2 QB with no backup behind him. They did have a 7th round rookie on the practice squad.

    September 30th, Rodgers is in a tight game with New Orleans. Packers are up 21-17. They are on the goal line getting ready to score, and Rodgers gets poked in the eye. He has to sit out one play. In comes Harrall. All he has to do is hand the ball off. It is his very first play in the NFL. Instead, he runs into his center and loses the football. GB almost loses that game, but manage to hang on and win.

    How pissed off would you be if that happened to the Bears but we lost the game by 3 points?

    Just reading more and more about this Harrall guy makes me think the Packers are going to go with Vince Young and B J Coleman as their backup QBs.

    And doing this cutting McCown and picking him back up midseason is not going to put a win back on the table if the untested kid blows it under the big lights for the first time. You want to ease someone like Blanchard in to the game slowly. It's unfair to expect him to be able to perform before he has a chance to learn the game.
  9. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

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    WNMOL, how did the Bears know if Orton could, how did NE know if Brady could, how did Hou know if Yates could, how did SF know if Kap could? How did Indy know if Luck could, how did Wash know if RGIII could, how did Wash know if Wilson could, how did Indy know if Sorgi could?

    Practice, and pre season that's the answer. You play them in practice and in pre season, and if the need arises and they you don't think they can well then go get a vet at that point in time, it's not like McCown won't be sitting out there waiting for a call up.

    LOL Soul talking about someone else being dogmatic or unwaivering in their opinion....hi pot.
  10. lklrlolnlilklsox

    lklrlolnlilklsox Position Coach

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    I don't dislike McCown. You can't hold the fact that he went to coach HS after flunking out of the league - because it just doesn't matter anymore. In fact, there's the thought that the opportunity gave him a greater perspective and understanding than he had previously.

    Having said that, I think Blanchard should be given equal reps with the second team and every opportunity to dethrone him as the vet backup. Put up or shut up, it's that simple for both guys.
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  11. AtomicTommy

    AtomicTommy DaBears Ditka

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    Huh? How does anyone know any QB is ready to play in the regular season before they actually do? lol
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  12. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

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    It's a beautifull circular logic to defend the flawed idea of the "vet backup"
  13. weneedmorelinemen

    weneedmorelinemen Veteran

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    The coaches give their best guess based off of the information they have. If they don't have any information, then they go with the guy they do know.
  14. weneedmorelinemen

    weneedmorelinemen Veteran

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    Call me Ned. It's easier. And I'm unwavering because I'm right.

    Orton was not ready to play in 2005 as a rookie. We just did not have anyone else that could play. You of course know that as a Bear fan. And Orton did such a bang up job in 2005 that we made him the 3rd string behind Griese in 2006.

    Tom Brady? If all you need is some practice and a preseason, why did Belichick make Tom Brady his 4th string QB instead of his second string? Hell, why didn't he start tom Brady in 2000? Why wait until 2001 and his starter was injured? Would you like to know why? Because he didn't know what he had, and because he didn't know, he made Brady earn his way and beat out the other guys DURING THE REGULAR SEASON of 2000. He had all year to make that judgement. And even after that season, he signed Bledsoe to a ten year extension.

    And why didn't he go into 2001 with only Tom Brady as his #2 and no #3 emergency QB? We are talking about one of the best QBs and best head coaches of all time. But there was Damon Huard, right there as the 3rd stringer. Why did they feel the need to have this 6 year vet taking up valuable roster space?

    Are you seriously asking me how Indy knew Luck or RGIII could play? How did Cleveland know LeBron James could play? Don't be silly. More was known about those two than about any QB coming out of college in recent memory.

    Yates was the damn 3rd stringer his rookie year. I've gone over this. Matt Leinhart was the backup QB, and played a whopping two plays before getting hurt. He got an opportunity and proved himself, but they didn't go into the season with him as the only option.
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2013
  15. JPosh2012

    JPosh2012 Pro-Bowler

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    I'd like to remind everyone that McCown didn't play HORRIBLE in the GB game in 2011. Was he great??? NO! Was he terrible??? Heck No!
  16. Henry Burris

    Henry Burris Head Coach

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    I see what you're doing there, and I'll just throw this out: Caleb Hanie.


    IDC what's happening in the game right now, DGAS, to tell the truth, but I do like what I'm seeing outta Long. The way ESPN's talking about him, tho, is like he's the offensive line equivalent of Russell Wilson last year.
  17. JPosh2012

    JPosh2012 Pro-Bowler

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    I am not defending McCown. I am just stating fact. While I am not a fan of McCown he does his job. Remember when Favre was the QB in Green Bay who was his lacky for many years???? Doug Freakin Peterson.
  18. lklrlolnlilklsox

    lklrlolnlilklsox Position Coach

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    Jay could take some big things away from watching Josh on his series. Mainly, pocket comfort and read progression ( aka, how not to stare down Marshall ).
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  19. weneedmorelinemen

    weneedmorelinemen Veteran

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    I don't know how Indy got away with having Jim Sorgi as the backup for Payton Manning all those years. If they only knew that every year they needed to rotate out the backup QB for a new guy so he could mentor him.
  20. MPbears68

    MPbears68 Pro-Bowler

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    Agreed. And if Blanchard is hurt, McCown in #2. Somewhere, Ric is drinking cyanide.

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