cutler really a giant puzzle

Discussion in 'Chicago Bears' started by a_miljan, Sep 29, 2013.

  1. Strangerwithcandy11

    Strangerwithcandy11 Head Coach

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    Yup. In this offense, this year, in the fourth game (three of those being wins, fourth quarter come backs to boot) Jay looked bad. I'd say that givin the history of Jay in those other systems on those specific days shows a pattern of shitty QB who can't do shit but lose a game here or there.

    Look I'm not saying Jay was good today. What I'm saying is in the other three games this year Jay was plenty good enough to win. In fact he helped us win those games. If you wanna use one out of four games in this system to say that Jay isn't the QB of the future then fine. I say that's special needs at least. Lets just use this game to say that for the next 5 years we're rebuilding. Come the fuck on people
  2. MPbears68

    MPbears68 Pro-Bowler

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    Here's what I'm saying:
    Is Jay Cutler a bad quarterback? No. Not at all.
    In fact he's above average.
    The problem is that he's not enough above average to go to the SB (without a stellar D and STs which we don't have anymore like we did in 2006).
    This season, and Trestman's hiring, is all about Jay. It's about whether--after giving him a better OL, better receiving weapons, and a real O coaching staff--or not he can go to next level of a near-elite QB. One worthy of investing big cash in going forward at the age of 30. It's about finding out how much of his past screw ups were due to surrounding cast and how much is inherent to his own uncoachable shortcomings (let's call it "bad Jay").
    Yes, it was only "one bad game" (so far). But we have seen this show before and it looks a lot like the Bad Jay of 2009-12. If there are more Bad Jay showings to come, and Bad Jay clearly still lives, I don't see how you can sink $15 million+/yr into that.
    I hope I'm wrong but I fear we haven't seen the last of Bad Jay.
  3. Strangerwithcandy11

    Strangerwithcandy11 Head Coach

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    Ok lets agree that "he's above average". Lets even agree that we don't have a "stellar D or STs" anymore. We've givin him a better Oline and WRs core and real coaching for how long now? We're four games into it. Three of which we win and in a couple of those we won in part because of Cutlers play. Is he worth all that money if today is ALL we can expect? The answer is NO. The rub is what we saw in the weeks leading up to today. The rub is how long are you willing to put off winning to groom another QB? We're not in the position to "win" and start over at the same time. Have you seen Tillman this year? Have you seen Peppers and Briggs? We have a "winning" window and its about three years. If we groom a new QB we're looking at 5 to seven before we become relevant.

    Jay is a good QB. He's not perfect and he's not the best. I don't see anything on the horizen that's perfect or better.
  4. MPbears68

    MPbears68 Pro-Bowler

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    Jay needs to "raise his floor". That means eliminating the Bad Jay suckfests in which he throws and fumbles away (literally) a winnable game.

    Matt Ryan wasn't great today. He missed some throws and left plays out there. But he didn't single-handedly beat his own team by turning the ball over like a cheap whore. He kept his team in the game--despite being "not sharp" and playing against better competition--and had a shot to win or tie down to the last minute. He didn't put his team into an insurmountable hole like Cutler does all too often when he flips into Bad Jay mode. That's the difference.

    Raise the floor. Until Cutler proves he's done that I can't see paying him huge cash better spent elsewhere. Lets see what he does next week against New Orleans and in week 9 at Green Bay. If he soils himself again, I hope Emery puts the Cutler Kool-aid away and plans for moving on.
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  5. Loki

    Loki Assault Admin Staff Member

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    Mr. D, or whatever you wanna call yourself... telling someone to "calm your tits" is allowable... barely. Hell, it's not even a personal attack.

    But we WILL NOT ALLOW direct discussion about family members. Your momma, your wife, etc... those out of bounds.

    You've skated the very edge of the TOS for quite a while now. You find the "troll line" and stop about 1" short. You do it often enough and it's now become a hassle.

    I am now letting you know that you need to become the most compliant and polite person on this board. Even if someone eggs you on... you need to "calm your tits" and be the very epitome of friendly, professional and rule-compliant.

    Or you will be gone. Permanently.

    WORDS OF ADVICE TO ANYONE WHO WOULD TRY TO BAIT HIM: The above goes for any of you as well. If your gonna start a fight that gets someone banned, I'm damn sure gonna let you join him on the bench.
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  6. ZifanQ

    ZifanQ Pro-Bowler

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    I agree we can't afford to start over, but it would be usefull with a stable QB. If we wanna have a decent chance of getting to the SB Cutler has to play stable. This performance was just as bad as his 4th quarter come backs were. Regardless of new system or not the balls were over- and underthrown and I don't think that has anything to do with being in a new system afaik.
  7. Grizzblue

    Grizzblue Pro-Bowler

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    I get what your saying but lofting ducks up 5 yards short off your back foot to a scraping saftey has nothing to do with scheme. Nor does missing wide open receivers or lazily holding on to the ball for 6+ seconds.

    None of this has anything to do with scheme, just the same old crap he has always done. Like I said I'm not ready to jump ship now, but one or 2 more of these utter meltdowns and I may be singing a different tune.
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  8. A-11

    A-11 Veteran

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    Stranger, that is the problem. The next five years. Jay on most games is good enough to win, that is a fact. He has an elite amount of talent, and that is why he will cost a fortune to keep around. The problem, is that he is NOT an elite quarterback because there is no constancy. Woodson's quote, "...it's the same-old Jay. We don't need luck; Jay will throw us the ball," speaks volumes. It is the truth because when the going gets rough he has given the D the ball. I posted a silly/stupid thread about Cutler and my random thoughts because as a franchised quarterback he scares me. I don't doubt his work ethic, his football intelligence,talent, etc., and I can live with the perceived attitude I have of him also, where he shields his thoughts from the media and fans. I don't like it, but I get it.

    The problem is that I feel trapped as a fan. There is no replacement or prospect in place, atm. The best (plan B) solution I've seen suggested is to get a C to B level vet and draft a high level prospect next year. And unless that prospect is a winning lottery ticket, you're going to downgrade the position. $15 million to tag Jay, or even a 3 year contract is going to mean the loss of another important player on the team. Being 30 I expect he is looking to be on a contract for five, so expect a few to have to walk in that scenario.

    There is no other position that can change your teams performance like the QB. The first couple games where Jay lead us from behind was a breath of fresh air. He was getting rid of the ball quickly, decisive and when he couldn't let it fly right off the bat he was stepping into the pocket making good choices. I'm wanting a QB that can do that constantly. Like MPbears68 pointed out, I am not seeing any internal clock.

    Emery has 13 key players in the final year of their contracts (Cutler, Gould, Hester, Jennings, Tillman...). He was quoted as saying, "I guess if you're saying an enormous amount of leverage [for Cutler], that means we've had a great season... that's a problem I look forward to." I do not think anyone wants to go back to the grab bag circus of QB's, because who knows how long it will take before you even get anything decent?

    Yes, one game and the whole topic is probably is overreaction. However, this isn't Jay's first rodeo and to be honest I'm cool with what ever Emery and Trestman decide. I'm no Cutler fan, but he is the best option I see right now.

    "Hey! Emery I want to see you pull a rabbit out of your ____! Thanks!" - a fan
  9. staley_rulz

    staley_rulz Rookie

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    If his name were Favre all would be forgiven
  10. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

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    If his name was Brett Farve he'd have been to multiple playoffs, multiple Div championship games and would have won a SB by now, so ya. I can forgive Flacco and Eli b/c they have proven if the team goes to the post season they can take over from there and help the team in a SB or 2. Cutler hasn't proven that so he's not going to get that same forgiveness.
  11. staley_rulz

    staley_rulz Rookie

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    So you are saying Favre could have done the same with our past O-coordinators, o-line and GM drafting? My point is people rip on Jay more because they don't like his personality and don't judge his football skills on football skills only. They can hate him more because he isn't an charismatic entertainer.
  12. staley_rulz

    staley_rulz Rookie

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    Yesterday I saw things Jay doesn't normally do in a game and that was throwing ducks all over thge place....not bad decisions. Compared to his bad games this was an irregular one.
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  13. Tarkus

    Tarkus Veteran

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    Damn...

    Tough crowd. lol

    So we've thrown in an offensive HC with a history of putting QBs in the position to win, thrown in a complete new scheme, new OL, new receivers, & 2 out of 3 games, Cutler's done his part.

    But now the experiment's over for some cuz the instant gratification stopped.

    Like I said...tough crowd.
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  14. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka DBS Writer

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    Don't know what he would have done. So you're theory is Farve was a product of everything around him? Lets see how many GB rb's and WR's TE's and OL and coaches got the HoF w/him.

    Farve, as much as I hate the man, and as much as I loved watching him crap his pants late in his career, was an absolute terror in the 90's; and if you think that was all coaches and weapons I got some prime vaction property in North Dakota for ya.
  15. Strangerwithcandy11

    Strangerwithcandy11 Head Coach

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    LOL Exactly. I don't know what to make of it. Everyone is on a roller coaster of emotions. If we win/Jay does well its pay the man or nice to see him turning things around. One week later after a bad game and he took all the blame (as he should) its blow the whole thing up lol. I can't wait to see who lines up to commit suicide next week lol
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  16. staley_rulz

    staley_rulz Rookie

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    No not my theory, and No thanks I already have a beautiful lake cabin creepy web stalker.
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  17. JustAnotherBearsFan99

    JustAnotherBearsFan99 Coordinator SuperFan DBS Writer

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    I don't think it's over-reacting to want "Bad Jay" to stay away in big games. Maybe Trestman can help Jay. I hope he can.
  18. MPbears68

    MPbears68 Pro-Bowler

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    No, it's not over-reacting to ask your QB to make his "bad days" LESS BAD. It's one thing to be "not sharp" and another thing to turn the ball over willy-nilly and take your team out of contention. Jay is on pace to have 32 QB turnovers and no team can overcome that week after week. Yes, there are issues on D and STs too but poor ball security from the signal caller is the "cheapest fix" this team needs going forward.
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  19. JustAnotherBearsFan99

    JustAnotherBearsFan99 Coordinator SuperFan DBS Writer

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    Jay did look bad yesterday. I commented to my wife, wondering if he got enough sleep the night before.
  20. DaTreeBears

    DaTreeBears Pro-Bowler

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    Maybe Jay's just one of those guys that needs Midol at certain times of month it was the 4th game of the month. There fix it good Jay all the time next fix D line.

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