Tucker: Round 2

Discussion in 'Chicago Bears' started by Grizzblue, Mar 27, 2014.

  1. The Benjamin

    The Benjamin George Halas
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    No doubt. Our defense was bad before the injuries. But I think we would have been a lot better (maybe middle of the pack) if not for the injuries
     
  2. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka
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    The D was bad before the inj's, but WAS middle of the field, which would have been acceptable by most who saw a decrease on the horizon regardless of who the DC was.
     
  3. JustAnotherBearsFan99

    JustAnotherBearsFan99 Assistant Head Coach
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    The metric often used is AGL, Adjusted Games Lost. There are others used too (Man Games Lost). And of course, injuries do affect a team, but you'd be surprised that good teams often do overcome injuries and perform well. Green Bay is one team that seems to do this - but they are far from the only team that overcomes injuries. Their super bowl year they had an outrageously high AGL (over 80 AGL, games lost) yet the won a super bowl that year. Did injuries hurt their team that year? Sure. But they won the Super Bowl anyway.

    In 2012, Green Bay's AGL was off the planet high (108 AGL games lost), yet they won the division - we didn't. - and we were the 3rd healthiest team in the NFL that year (AGL). Winners find a way to win championships. Losers lose.

    Even if you look at this in terms of MGL (man games lost), the Packers last year were at 195, and we were significantly healthier at 177. Seattle won the Super Bowl and they had over 150 MGL. Was Seattle hurt by injuries? You bet. Did they win anyway? Yes. They won the Super Bowl.

    Winners find ways to win & overcome adversity. Losers? They lose.

    EDIT: You can Google these metrics on Football Outsiders and other sites. I like the Football Outsiders site myself.
     
    #43 JustAnotherBearsFan99, Mar 27, 2014
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2014
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  4. short faced bear

    short faced bear Assistant Head Coach
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    I don't know how much adversity could have been overcame last season but a solid scheme, fundamentals, and communication were not one of them. With new coaches in almost any sport there are injuries and adversity-some more than others. Not once last season did I see even a remote glimmer of things to come. Not even a small nuance.

    Right now until he proves me wrong I'd have to agree w/Ski about Tucker. Hope to eat crow about it though.
     
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  5. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka
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    JABF, if you were to list what each player was worth to a team in games won/lost, where are Briggs, Tillman, Melton, DJ, Collins worth? Would that amount to 1 or 2 games?
    I'm betting Briggs and Tillman would be worth around a half a game a piece at least, and probably Melton too. that's 1.5 games right there minimum, probably more honestly. That's not including DJ or Collins.

    That is a playoff spot, is Tucker a shitty DC when he's part of a playoff team for the first time in years?

    This also doesn't take into account a guy lost but wasn't inj'd like Wootton who was on the field, but not as effective b/c of those inj's.
    Is Wootton at DE instead of Shea worth at least 1 game? I think he is. Are teams running for 6ypc w/Melton and Wootton on the DL instead of Wootton and Shea or is it closer to 4? Now add in Paea playing hurt and not being as effective, if he's able to plant are teams trucking through the middle, no and that's sitting under 4 ypc now, is that a bad D ranking near the bottom?

    GB during their SB year still never lost pro bowlers at the rate the Bears lost last year.
     
  6. JustAnotherBearsFan99

    JustAnotherBearsFan99 Assistant Head Coach
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    I would counter to say that some of this is subjective & you can't scientifically measure it. I agree that the metrics in place don't measure injury impact between teams perfectly by any means. And I'm not saying injuries to starters don't hurt ALL teams EVERY season. We can whine about how ours is bigger than theirs. But I believe winners often find ways to overcome injury and adversity. We have all seen this, and it spans many (if not all) team sports, and at all levels (not just pro teams).

    There are a number of reasons why we gave the division away to the Packers last year - and in other years. Injuries certainly play a role in that. Last season is over and we've pretty much beat the dead horse here about the injury thing. I don't think anyone is going to change their view on the subject (I'm not). Let's just hope the Bears (and yes, I'm hoping the Cubs) can win a championship here in Chicago. I'm getting tired of the excuses as to why we fall short every year. Here's to a bright new year and hope :)
    I'm getting tired of the "lovable losers" thing.
     
  7. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka
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    your AGL is just as subjective though.

    Winning GM's draft better and create more viable depth then what JA did, your asking Tucker to lose 3 pro bowlers and several other key peices and to coach up guys that shouldn't be there and comparing to what a team that has succesfully drafted for starters and depth did. It's not a equal comparisson.
     
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  8. JustAnotherBearsFan99

    JustAnotherBearsFan99 Assistant Head Coach
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    I agree about the AGL. I also agree that the better GM's draft better and create more viable depth. I'm not trying to lump all the blame on anyone, but I'm also not trying to excuse everyone - if that makes any sense. Plenty of blame to go around, and certainly some blame does go to injuries with pitiful depth. I do believe Emery will keep us with stronger depth from here on out. He probably needs one more year (and draft) to truly do this on both defense and offense......the offense still needs better depth at some positions too.
     
  9. riczaj01

    riczaj01 DaBears Ditka
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    That's fair JABF, but I think in the list of blame for the D woe's you can assign in order of importance this:
    JA/Lovie-Lack of Talent/Depth
    Inj's to key components ie pro bowler/starters
    Emery/Tucker letting the inmates run the assylem/not being able to adapt to the problem at hand.
     
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  10. butkus3595

    butkus3595 Pro-Bowler

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    I already addressed Green Bay's Super Bowl team. They lost ONE impact defensive STARTER that season for the majority of the season/post season in Morgan Burnett. Other than that they lost nobody if large importance, they had 4 pro bowlers on that defense. Their 2012 team didn't lose the amount of impact starters either, and we were a play away from winning the division.

    So as I said, find me the team that lost the amount of IMPACT STARTERS that we lost on defense that were successful.
     
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